They looked like they just came from a vault from fallout
pngcrush gets it down to 21.1 kB with no loss of quality.
I tried posting the file, but Lemmy converts it to the atrocious webp format automatically.
EDIT: JPEG-XL clocks in at just 16.3 kB, again with no loss of quality.the atrocious webp format
I continue to be confused by the level of widespread hate WebP still gets. It’s old enough to be widely (albeit not universally) supported in software like web browsers, but new enough to provide similar-or-better (usually better) lossless compression than PNG (21,578 bytes for the original image) and typically better lossy compression than JPEG at comparable perceived quality, especially for the types of images typically shared on the internet (rather than say, images saved directly from a DLSR camera). It’s why servers bother to re-encode JPEG images to WebP for delivery - they wouldn’t bother wasting the compute time to re-compress if it wasn’t generally worth doing.
I can understand it if we were, say, 10-15 years ago when the format was still not super widely supported yet, but that’s basically where we are with JPEG XL and AVIF support right now too. If one of these two had exactly the level of support that WebP does right now then yes, of course we should probably use one of them instead - but we’re not there yet. Until we are, WebP often has the best compromise between compatibility and compression efficiency as far as image formats go, and that’s why a lot of sites do this re-compression thing using WebP. I gave some examples using digital art (one of the things I was compressing a lot at the time) a year ago in a related discussion: https://lemmy.world/post/6665251/4462007
A news website local to me recently-ish started choosing to deliver AVIF-compressed (or probably re-compressed) images the same way a lot of sites currently do it for WebP because my browser supports AVIF, so at least we are starting to see a token amount of uptake on the next-gen formats in the wild.
I’m a dev and webp is incredible. Don’t really understand the hate - it’s a libre format that is lighyears ahead of png or jpg in every measurable metric. The lack of support is entirely on app developers and their incompetence not the format.
The other formats like jpeg xl are only catching up now when webp was out for 14 years already.
JXL for the win! when will we get support for it in firefox though…
Never…
Everyone should use jxl for their photos
Fyi, dithering hinders most modern compression algorythms, making the pic bigger.
I mean… if we reeeaaally wanna carbon date ourselves…
Didn’t GIFs load from the bottom?
No. You’re thinking of jifs
It was top to bottom unless the image had a rotation flag in it. I don’t remember if it was just PNG that had that or if other formats could too.
I distinctively remember GIFs loading bottom to top, left to right, which does not make sense with a rotation flag. Not sure why you’re pulling PNG into this, that’s an entirely different file format.
Not sure why you’re pulling PNG into this, that’s an entirely different file format.
Just mentioning what format I remembered it with since I dont remember if the rotation flag was in the image file formatting, in the webpage, or if it could be specified in either place.
I remember when it went down by half an inch a second. Those were the times
And websites would have a link to a page and say “Warning! This page contains a lot of pictures!” so you wouldn’t click it unless you were prepared to put your other browsing on hold for a little while
I was grabbing some files originally made for some old DOS software a few years ago and the site had a warning for the 20MB text file download. Like, my good friend that’s just the front page of CNN these days! Thank you for your concern but now it just seems quaint rather than thoughtful
The whole man is insufficient Data, I love Data so much 🥹
That smirk is what makes it
All that’s missing is the modem ear rape.
There were reports of teenage boys becoming so conditioned that they would get an erection when they heard a modem dialling
The internet has always been about porn
The first ever image digitally transmitted was a playboy centrefold. “The Lena”
Unironically I love that so much lol
On the off chance you haven’t experienced the Floppotron:
I fuckin love the floppotron! 🥰
ALL HAIL THE FLOPPOTRON
Glory to the Floppotron!
Geez, that’s some dedication. And where do you even get 64 working floppy drives?
It was posted 8 years ago, so slightly easier to gather up those relics then.
If I had to guess, the guy might have worked IT for a school or something that went through a modernization, with all the old tech going to the dumpster; got the idea and jumped on it.
*Phone rings*
deleted by creator
This JPEG is just 41 KiB, which was the style shortly after I was born.
Avif, without alpha channel, 17.6 KB
Excuse me, I forgot the text. Wouldn’t be fair without all that entropy. To make up for it, I turned on chroma subsampling. This one is 39 KiB.
To be more accurate, the dithering was more specific to animated gifs and not static pictures. Unless you go back really far… I remember finding porn on 5 inch floppies my dad had in his closet and even the non-animated images were black & white and dithered to hell. Though I am pretty sure he didn’t obtain those off the internet.
Dithered Street Fighter porn?
I turned on chroma subsampling
43KiB, though obviously a chunk of that is from the colors of the jpg Professor.
EDIT: I just noticed webp messes with colors around the edges too (which would matter more if I cut the resolution in half or so). The original .png (what I actually uploaded) doesn’t at 51.6KiB.
Also obviously this would be less data in non-pixel format (well, it’d likely be eaten up by overhead for packaging, though after that it would allow tons of art for negligible data cost). Would be smaller as an svg for example (or an swf).
how small can u get this with the text still readable?
Depends on what you consider readable, but I got it down to 2842 bytes by downscaling it and using an absolutely atrocious quality setting:
That’s just small enough to fit inside a QR code, so I did that! (You probably can’t scan it with a typical QR reader; you need something like zbar that supports reading binary data).
You’re fun. That may sound sarcastic, but I’m being serious lol. Learned a lot in just two comments and you just seem very cheerful writing it all/messing with this.
nice :D
in a different timeline where the GIF89 specification would not have been mostly ignored, it would have been possible to go even smaller.
“The GIF89 specification allows you to specify text captions to be overlayed on the following image. This feature never took off; browsers and image-processing applications such as Photoshop ignore it”
Meaning if your gif viewing client supports full GIF89 then you could just display the text over a 1x1 pixel image, shrinking the file size down to something in the range of < 100bytes.
In that vein, I’d be interested to see if someone could Inkscape it into an SVG with embedded text.
Though I have no idea how many vectors would be needed to make the image similar enough.
The SVG send me down a rabid hole, apparently SVG embedded text is actually selectable and all, this is basically what gif tryed to do and failed lol
but sadly lemmy dosent seem to let upload .svg :/
At that point you might as well just send it as text.
But the artifacts!
could you get it small enough to fit in a data uri so phone qr scanners will read it?
Unfortunately most QR readers don’t recognize an image regardless of the data format.
but maybe they could open it in a browser which could display it
Dithering is much older than jpeg.
They used dithering in printed media, so it was transfered to digital media as a way to save on color depth, before jpeg got invented.
_
We listened to music as 41kB RealAudio files that sounded like the song was underwater, which was the style at the time.
Back when image compression was just reducing the resolution and color depth.
i mean yeah, its a honest loss of information, jpg on the other hand introduces compression artifacts that are basically hallucinations, meaning it pretends to have more data than it actually has and humans compensate for that thru image recognition and fantasy.
I mean, that’s what dithering is
An artifact that your brain processes as something else.
It’s really only helpful for formats that will be directly read by hardware (the video chip) and where the “compression” ratio (I would prefer the term quantization) needs to be fixed. For file compression, which was quite mature but CPU- and memory-intensive at the time, the dithering only makes it more difficult to compress further.
Compressed textures on modern GPUs actually use similar compression: a color palette followed by indexes into the palette. But that’s done per 4x4 pixel block.
What do you mean “at the time”?
What time are you talking about?At the time when dithering was commonly used to achieve the illusion of more available colors, i.e. the 80s and the first half of the 90s.
I’m not really convinced that file compression was “mature” at the time. Text compression was reasonable progressed but image compression was created for a reason besides just a requirement for fixed compression ratio.
But I do agree that dithering was limited in it’s usefulness.
My point was just that dithering existed in print media, so it was one of the first ways they used to reduce image size, they just copied over the same technique
I’m thinking of file compression formats like Zip, LHA and ARJ, which would work particularly well if the image was not dithered and used run-length encoding (e.g. the PIC format of the Atari ST). The PNG format still uses the deflate algorithm which is essentially identical to the compression used by PKZip in 1991.
Dithering is so fucking cool. At some point I wanna check out that game that uses a ton of really stylized dithering - return of the obra djin I think?
Dithering is still to this day extremely useful for making custom wall art in Minecraft using maps, because maps have a very specific and limited pallette.
Obra Dinn’s filter hurt my eyes. A lot of these filters do and glad many are toggles in the options.
That’s very fair, that’s a consequence of using a shader based artstyle I really hadn’t considered
This.exe file including music and visuals is 4KB
What about 256 byte executables? That’s a 16th of 4KB!
Oooh now we’re getting into drive formatting choices and filesystem quirks!
I miss dithering. It’s got a certain je ne sais quoi.
Mmh, diffuse dither … give me some Bayer dither!
