Need to let loose a primal scream without collecting footnotes first? Have a sneer percolating in your system but not enough time/energy to make a whole post about it? Go forth and be mid: Welcome to the Stubsack, your first port of call for learning fresh Awful youāll near-instantly regret.
Any awful.systems sub may be subsneered in this subthread, techtakes or no.
If your sneer seems higher quality than you thought, feel free to cutānāpaste it into its own post ā thereās no quota for posting and the bar really isnāt that high.
The post Xitter web has spawned soo many āesotericā right wing freaks, but thereās no appropriate sneer-space for them. Iām talking redscare-ish, reality challenged āculture criticsā who write about everything but understand nothing. Iām talking about reply-guys who make the same 6 tweets about the same 3 subjects. Theyāre inescapable at this point, yet I donāt see them mocked (as much as they should be)
Like, there was one dude a while back who insisted that women couldnāt be surgeons because they didnāt believe in the moon or in stars? I think each and every one of these guys is uniquely fucked up and if I canāt escape them, I would love to sneer at them.
(Credit and/or blame to David Gerard for starting this.)
Veering semi-OT: the guy behind the godawful Windows 11 GUI has revealed himself:
Looking at his Twitter profile, its clear heās a general dumpster fire of a human being - most of his feedās just him retweeting AI garbage or fash garbage.
@BlueMonday1984 lol @ āI try not to let [performance] considerations get in the wayā
Also why do you even put a React Dev on that task š¤”
Pretty good summary of why Alex Karp is as much a horrible fucking shithead as Thiel.
https://www.thenation.com/article/culture/alex-karp-palantir-tech-republic/tnamp/
time amplifying the nonsense around saltmanās orb grift
features a helluva lot of words while at multiple points remaining entirely incurious about the claims it amplifies
OT: just got a job interview and wanted to pass the good vibes on!
Noice!
Tante has a couple of questions for Anthropic:
I was trying out free github copilot to see what the buzz is all about:
It doesnāt even know its own settings. This one little useful thing that isnāt plagiarism, providing natural language interface to its own bloody settings, it couldnāt do.
In the collection of links of what Ive has done in recent years, thereās one to an article about a turntable redesign he worked on, and from that article:
The Sondek LP12 has always been entirely retrofittable and Linn has released 50 modular hardware upgrades to the machine, something that Ive said he appreciates. āI love the idea that after years of ownership you can enjoy a product thatās actually better than the one you bought years before,ā said Ive.
I donāt know, should I laugh, or should I scream, that itās Ive, of all people, saying that.
I donāt get it, how is every one of the most touted people in the AI space among the least credible people in the industry.
Like literally every time its a person whose name I recognize from something else theyāve done, that something else is something I hate.
ED ZITRON
FROM THE TOP ROPE
New piece from Iris Meredith: Keeping up appearances, about the cultural forces that gave us LLMs and how best to defeat them
this is ridiculously good
Reminds me something F.D. Signifier said on a music podcast.
Progressives are losing the cultural war in a lot of ways, but theyāll always need us because weāre the ones pushing the boundaries on art, and it turns out, no matter how ghoulish people want to act, everyone has genuine love of fucking awesome art. The true loss condition is being captured by the tools of the master.
Rekindled a desire to maybe try my own blog ^^.
I think beyond āKeeping up appearancesā itās also the stereotype of fascistsāand by extension LLM loversāhaving trouble (or pretending to) distinguishing signifying and signified.
Cringe but my god the horde of buttmad nazis force me to be on weirdo & girl girlās side
Personally I have more questions about a Rationalist having an anarcho-communist flag tattoo.
anarcho-communist flag, username RatOrthodox, hangs out with eugenicist iq-anon types, somewhere on the longtermist scale. Has unblocked replies from a person who fell into all the alt-right signifiers and who is calling this āJewishā (anti-semitism and a holocaust joke, classy. If I sneer any harder I will start to look like Scott on that recent video).
It honestly reminds me of the stories youād hear from like the 60s and 70s of people cult-hopping because the specifics of the ideology or the religion didnāt matter as much as the sense of believing in something. Notably a fair number of those people ended up in evangelical churches and, presumably, maga.
See also how he finds it good that capitalism has no logo, but still desires a logo for capitalism. And suggests others want it too.
But hey, of all the cult leaders in the space, Aella is prob the least bad. At least her cult doesnāt come with a lot of mandatory reading homework.
I see now heās also got a supply and demand tattoo*? I donāt fucking know. Maybe he thinks red and black is the antifa flag. Maybe he got it for sexy humiliation purposes. Maybe itās faded blue ink.
Yeah okay. Boring!!! You suck!!!
I have so many questions, stuff like, do you know what laws of nature are? (also, see the weak link between supply and demand and capitalism, various non capitalist systems also have supply and demand curves. āim not economically illiterate, just ideologicallyā). And 13? Wtf is wrong with your parents that they allowed that? At least my earlier āwtf why is he hanging out with neo-nazisā has been answered.
E: also note the dead plant in the tattoo in progress pics. (An orchid I think).
I donāt know what it is with capitalists and needing to prove to themselves theyāre aligned with the natural order. Iām a marxist but I canāt imagine calling the TRPF a ālaw of natureā. It would be embarrassing!
*
(I know there are, like, dozens of āscientific communistā diamat weirdos, but for the most part they have rightfully been tied to a tree and left in the 20th century.)
I think it comes down to a deflection of the inherent cruelty of the system. Part of the structure of capitalism is that some people are going to suffer unjustly because your ability to get the resources you need to survive is gated behind your ability to either hold capital or provide value to capitalists. You donāt have to look far to find examples of people who are either physically unable to do so or who find that their proverbial cheese has been moved by economic forces beyond their control or understanding, and now the terms of their economic and social existence are wildly different and less favorable.
By comparison, evolution by natural selection relies on having more children than the environment can support and having a significant number of those children die before they can reproduce. This also creates a lot of suffering, but since itās a natural process rather than a social construct itās impossible to call any part of it out for cruelty. There is no exploiter, and so there can be no exploitation. We can feel bad for the slowest gazelle but we donāt morally condemn the lion because the suffering it creates is part of the natural world.
Of course, free market capitalism is not a natural process, there are things that we could do to mitigate or eliminate the suffering it creates, and trying to prevent that from happening is morally reprehensible. This is particularly true if youāre in a relatively privileged position like, say, a finance capitalist in a major startup hub or working in an industry that for various reasons has been given a significantly better deal than most working people. At that point youāre either doing the exploiting or siding with the exploiters and actively perpetuating unnecessary suffering. But if that suffering was natural then it wouldnāt be unnecessary and you wouldnāt be doing anything inarguably wrong.
Itās just Jordan Peterson and his goddamn lobsters again.
Yeah it fits a pattern, half of starship troopers is about how other societies had ideals not based on mathematical truths but theirs is (no proof is ever shown). Another reason why I think the book reads so much better as a parody. The Eternal Science of Marxism, but now for Warrior Libertarians (who cannot even fight a proper war, see the whole technodogs thing).
Ok I have to say, I despise aella but as a promiscuous woman I completely fail to see whatās supposed to be the problem with this particular form of play. That people like having casual sex? That they have slut pride? What.
I probably passed the 100 mark myself several years ago, Iāve hooked up with girls with much more obvious slut tattoos too, and weāre all antifascist anarchists. Is this community ok with sneering at public sexuality now?
The only thing I found vaguely mid in that X is using a tattoo gun rather than scarification, branding, or at least stick-and-poke. But I donāt kink-shame people for being casuals.
Personally I like sex work and amateur tattooing better when they arenāt part of some convoluted attempt at rationalist virtue signalling on social media. Honestly itās kind of weird that you landed on disapproval of promiscuity as the reason anyone here would find the happy couple sneerable.
Not strictly related to the OP but fuck kink-washing sfba rationalism, at the very least the attempted normalization of non-con sex play in a subculture as inundated with cult dynamics as them should be fair game.
I cannot understand the reason yāall find the couple sneerable, as I look at that tweet and see something I very much would have done to one of my partners if they asked, and the language used by the bottom as the same language my partners might have used to describe the activity. If anything itās very much on the tame side, for our standards. Promiscuity is me trying to understand what is it thatās so sneerable in the first place. Is it just ālol sex thing weirdā? Is it āyouāll regret your tattoo when you get olderā? Me and my girls have done so much more intensely weirder sex things and more risquĆ© tattoos. I expect to be ridiculed for it by like, cishet right-wing men, but to find that type of attitude here was shocking.
Like, āvirtue signallingā as in the thing that rats accuse us of doing every time we have a motivation they cannot comprehend such as basic empathy, right? As in the rationalistās stereotypically verbose euphemism for what previous generations of misogynistic male nerds used to call āattention whoringā? Is that the sneerable thing then, that people like showing off when they do an unusual sex thing? Because if so I have like, years of mastodon flirty banter yāall can go sneer at, if weāre branching out from ānerdy fascism badā to ākink on main badā.
are you aware of what discussion group youāre posting this to
The guy goes by the handle RatOrthodox, calls rationalism his religion in the replies, seems kind of a cult-brained ideologue anyway based on his other tattoos, and went out of his way to make boinking aella into a public achievement/trophy thing.
This is just from the OP, I bet I could find any number of additional absolutely ridiculous things about him if I bothered with his twitter feed (edit: someone else did). Basically he seems like sneer incarnate, and if rationalists ever stormed the capitol building I bet heād be the one with the face paint and the horned fur hat giving interviews.
Virtue signaling is not really interchangeable with attention whoring, itās when you specifically (and usually clumsily) want people to notice that you are part of an ingroup, and in this case the ingroup definitely isnāt just people who like amateur tattooing and horny post on main.
Maybe I should explicitly note that unless this turns out to be another aella publicity stunt she does seem pretty incidental to the whole thing and her only fault appears to be being attractive this type of weirdo in the first place, which Iām not blaming her for.
Think you are right, and tbh I didnāt read this as a kink thing but more some weird glorifying Aella as some sort of important cult leader thing (and misread it and assumed it had to do with the flowchart event, and not this (which I should have noticed was wrong as there were less than 100 people involved in that, for which a āI was nr 100ā is quite odd to me (and fits into the whole cultleader vibe))). A reason why I only focused on the guy myself.
And you are totally correct that people sneer on Aella way to much just because she is {a woman, sex worker, a bit strange, unapologetic about being a sex worker, has sex the wrong way, {more weird reasons unrelated to her being part of the āwe should do eugenics!ā crowd}} (pick any that apply). And have mentioned this before in other places. (oddly enough this caused somebody on bsky to just go full anti sex worker, so that was an easy block at least). But yes you are right to call us out on this.
My stance is that I hate Aella because she exploits her life experience to be a disgusting misogynist and it is morally correct to kinkshame unpleasant heterosexual men who associate with the rationalist sex cult. Iām not interested in other peopleās hangups beyond that.
oh, no, to be clear: this isnāt about the sex/sluttiness - I have no issue with that at all. in a more general sense (over the wider set of things aella), her positioning herself as a āsex researcherā but often using that to bash specific groups or put out a specific narrative, that is far more problematic
but regarding this specific thing, tho: the āforced a tattoo on meā bit specifically, and all the rationalists doing their weird quasi-intellectual arguing with everyone who asks questions. the āforcedā wording feels ā¦ intentionally bait&switch? presumably (ā¦hopefully?) thereās mutual consent here, so itās a fucking choice to go frame the event that way
Thatās very much the language my play partners use online, though? I totally post banter like āthat submissive was so blanked out that I took advantage of them by doing Xā, to which theyāll reply āimplying I didnāt evily manipulated you into doing that in the first placeā, and so on. This is so commonplace in my communities that I failed to even understand what could be the problem before you pointed it out. I mean, āI forced my famous domme to mark me as a trophy as her #100 simpā? How would you exactly force (non-kink sense) someone to tattoo you anyway, and if you did and were unwise enough to brag about it, presumably the microcelebrity in question wouldnāt like and retweet it? I took it to mean āI was so into the idea of being marked, Iām glad she agreed to my pesteringā, and I would bet money if any of my people talked in that exact wording, thatās what everyone would take it as. I mean, otherwise I would probably have been arrested for the frequency of times I say ābye everyone gonna tie someone up and do unspeakably cruel things to themā and whatnot
I think in this thread itās not āthis thing is gross because it involves sex stuffā, itās āthis sex stuff is made gross by the involvement of aella and co, who we understand to have fundamentally different and incorrect ideas about ethics both in general and specific to sexā
Basically anything Aella touches merits a sniff test.
Iām imagining the same statement from a different person, on a platform that is not Xitter, about a sex partner who is not Aella.
(thinks)
Pierre Menard, author of the Kink-ote
Gotta say, Iām not much of a JLB head, so I donāt fully understand this (would love an explainer!). At first glance I thought this was a Menards reference and super didnāt understand.
āPierre Menard, Author of the Quixoteā is a story about a man whose passion project is rewriting Don Quixote, that is, arriving at exactly the same text as Cervantes, but from his own experiences. The narrator quotes the same line from both and observes that the remark by Cervantes is empty rhetoric, while the statement by Menard alludes to a whole school of philosophy that did not exist in Cervantesā time. So, āThough they are verbally identical, Menardās is infinitely richer.ā
I wasnāt going for a deep-lore reference, just a bit of silly wordplay about the title.
This is more on Aella Cult than on her tbh.
And didnāt Aella and also Grimes have a come to jesus moment when they realized they hung out with a lot of bad people. Guess nothing came from that. (That part of them is always worse than these just a bit off antics they pull).
And didnāt Aella and also Grimes have a come to jesus moment when they realized they hung out with a lot of bad people
I would give this at least -9600 credibility points. neither of them are whoopsie-daisyāing into these scenes and crowds, they both knew what and who
Sorry I was being a bit too vague because I didnāt have any proof ready. But here it is. It is them covering their asses if there might be a fallout, a non-apology equivalent, as there has been no changes or dropping of names/extremist behavior since, it is all just vague vibes.
Girls think the āeuā in āeugenicsā means EW. Donāt get the ick, girls! It literally means good.
So if youāre not into eugenics, that means you must be into dysgenics. Dissing your own genes! OMG girl what
ā¦ how is this man still able to post from inside the locker he should be stuffed in 24/7
Seeing Yarvin mansplain eugenics really does make one wonder how he doesnāt just get suckerpunched whenever he says anything at someone in public.
The eigenrobot thread heās responding to is characteristically bizarre and gross. Youād think eigenrobot being anti-eugenics is a good thing but he still finds a way to make it suspect. (He believes being unable to make babies is worse than death?)
I think he means āmass sterilisation of a populationā Vs āmass murder of the same populationā, which is genocide either way, and then he would opt for the faster method.
Or something. Feels extra creepy discussing which genocide is better with the ongoing genocide in Gaza.
Re: extra creepy: and also with people their people in power.
I mean I guess you can argue that straight up murder has a certain honesty to it? At the same time that is mainly good because it makes it harder to justify whatās happening compared to anti-miscegenation laws or restricting people to an open-air prison for a few generations. And we can see how thatās working out in the current political climate.
Not beating the sexism allegations.
sounds like heās posting from inside a dilapidated white panel van parked strategically just outside a legally-mandated exclusion radius surrounding a middle school
So, heās essentially Drake if he got into AI doom
A new LLM plays pokemon has started, with o3 this time. It plays moderately faster, and the twitch display UI is a little bit cleaner, so it is less tedious to watch. But in terms of actual ability, so far o3 has made many of the exact same errors as Claude and Gemini including: completely making things up/seeing things that arenāt on the screen (items in Virdian Forest), confused attempts at navigation (it went back and forth on whether the exit to Virdian Forest was in the NE or NW corner), repeating mistakes to itself (both the items and the navigation issues I mentioned), confusing details from other generations of Pokemon (Nidoran learns double kick at level 12 in Fire Red and Leaf Green, but not the original Blue/Yellow), and it has signs of being prone to going on completely batshit tangents (it briefly started getting derailed about sneaking through the tree in Virdian Forestā¦ i.e. moving through completely impassable tiles).
I donāt know how anyone can watch any of the attempts at LLMs playing Pokemon and think (viable) LLM agents are just around the cornerā¦ well actually I do know: hopium, cope, cognitive bias, and deliberate deception. The whole LLM playing Pokemon thing is turning into less of a test of LLMs and more entertainment and advertising of the models, and the scaffold are extensive enough and different enough from each other that they really arenāt showing the modelsā raw capabilities (which are even worse than I complained about) or comparing them meaningfully.
I like how all of the currently running attempts have been equipped with automatic navigation assistance, i.e. a pathfinding algorithm from the 60s. And thatās the only part of the whole thing that actually works.
I wouldnāt say even that part works so well, given how Mt. Moon is such a major challenge even with all the features like that.
The actual pathfinding algorithm (which is surely just A* search or similar) works just fine; the problem is the LLM which uses it.
Im sure this is fine https://infosec.exchange/@paco/114509218709929701
"Paco Hope #resist @paco@infosec.exchange
OMG. #Microsoft #Copilot bypasses #Sharepoint #security so you donāt have to!
āCoPilot gets privileged access to SharePoint so it can index documents, but unlike the regular search feature, it doesnāt know about or respect any of the access controls you might have set up. You can get CoPilot to just dump out the contents of sensitive documents that it can see, with the bonus feature* that your access wonāt show up in audit logs.ā
The S in CoPilot stands for Security! https://pivotnine.com/the-crux/archive/remembering-f00fs-of-old/"
Another critihype article from the BBC, with far too much credulousness at the idea behind supposed AI consciousness at the cost of covering the harms of AI as things stand, e.g. the privacy, environmental, data set bias problems:
Tried to read it, ended up glazing over after the first or second paragraph, so Iāll fire off a hot take and call it a day:
Artificial intelligence is a pseudoscience, and it should be treated as such.
Every AI winter, the label AI becomes unwanted and people go with other terms (expert systems, machine learning, etc.)ā¦ and Iāve come around to thinking this is a good thing, as it forces people to specify what it is they actually mean, instead of using a nebulous label with many science fiction connotations that lumps together decent approaches and paradigms with complete garbage and everything in between.
Iām gonna be polite, but your position is deeply sneerworthy; I donāt really respect folks who donāt read. The article has quite a few quotes from neuroscientist Anil Seth (not to be confused with AI booster Anil Dash) who says that consciousness can be explained via neuroscience as a sort of post-hoc rationalizing hallucination akin to the multiple-drafts model; his POV helps deflate the AI hype. Quote:
There is a growing view among some thinkers that as AI becomes even more intelligent, the lights will suddenly turn on inside the machines and they will become conscious. Others, such as Prof Anil Seth who leads the Sussex University team, disagree, describing the view as āblindly optimistic and driven by human exceptionalism.ā ā¦ āWe associate consciousness with intelligence and language because they go together in humans. But just because they go together in us, it doesnāt mean they go together in general, for example in animals.ā
At the end of the article, another quote explains that Seth is broadly aligned with us about the dangers:
In just a few years, we may well be living in a world populated by humanoid robots and deepfakes that seem conscious, according to Prof Seth. He worries that we wonāt be able to resist believing that the AI has feelings and empathy, which could lead to new dangers. āIt will mean that we trust these things more, share more data with them and be more open to persuasion.ā But the greater risk from the illusion of consciousness is a āmoral corrosionā, he says. āIt will distort our moral priorities by making us devote more of our resources to caring for these systems at the expense of the real things in our livesā ā meaning that we might have compassion for robots, but care less for other humans.
A pseudoscience has an illusory object of study. For example, parapsychology studies non-existent energy fields outside the Standard Model, and criminology asserts that not only do minds exist but some minds are criminal and some are not. Robotics/cybernetics/artificial intelligence studies control loops and systems with feedback, which do actually exist; further, the study of robots directly leads to improved safety in workplaces where robots can crush employees, so itās a useful science even if it turns out to be ill-founded. I think that your complaint would be better directed at specific AGI position papers published by techbros, but that would require reading. Still, Iāll try to salvage your position:
Any field of study which presupposes that a mind is a discrete isolated event in spacetime is a pseudoscience. That is, fields oriented around neurology are scientific, but fields oriented around psychology are pseudoscientific. This position has no open evidence against it (because itās definitional!) and aligns with the expectations of Seth and others. It is compatible with definitions of mind given by Dennett and Hofstadter. It immediately forecloses the possibility that a computer can think or feel like humans; at best, maybe a computer could slowly poorly emulate a connectome.
I am not sure that having āan illusory object of studyā is a standard that helps define pseudoscience in this context. Consider UFOlogy, for example. It arguably āstudiesā things that do exist ā weather balloons, the planet Venus, etc. Pseudoarchaeology āstudiesā actual inscriptions and actual big piles of rocks. Wheat gluten and seed oils do have physical reality. Itās the explanations put forth which are unscientific, while attempting to appeal to the status of science. The āresearchā now sold under the Artificial Intelligence banner has become like Intelligent Design āresearchā: Computers exist, just like bacterial flagella exist, but the claims about them are untethered.
Scientists and philosophers have spilled a tanker truck of ink about the question of how to demarcate science from non-science or define pseudoscience rigorously. But we can bypass all that, because the basic issue is in fact very simple. One of the most fundamental parts of living a scientific life is admitting that you donāt know what you donāt know. Without that, itās well-nigh impossible to do the work. Meanwhile, the generative AI industry is built on doing exactly the opposite. By its very nature, it generates slop that sounds confident. It is, intrinsically and fundamentally, anti-science.
Now, on top of that, while being anti-science the AI industry also mimics the form of science. Look at all the shiny PDFs! Theyāve got numbers in them and everything. Tables and plots and benchmarks! I think that any anti-science activity that steals the outward habits of science for its own purposes will qualify as pseudoscience, by any sensible definition of pseudoscience. In other words, wherever we draw the line or paint the gray area, modern āAIā will be on the bad side of it.
No, I think BlueMonday is being reasonable. The article has some quotes from scientists with actually relevant expertise, but it uncritically mixes them with LLM hype and speculation in a typical both sides sort of thing that gives lay readers the (false) impression that both sides are equal. This sort of journalism may appear balanced, but it ultimately has contributed to all kinds of controversies (from Global Warming to Intelligent Design to medical pseudoscience) where the viewpoints of cranks and uninformed busybodies and autodidacts of questionable ability and deliberate fraudsters get presented equally with actually educated and researched viewpoints.
Having now read the thing myself, I agree that the BBC is serving up criti-hype and false balance.
ā¦fields oriented around neurology are scientific, but fields oriented around psychology are pseudoscientific.
When a good man gazes into the palantir and sees L Ron Hubbard looking back
To be fair I also believe psychology is by and large pseudoscience, but the answer to it is sociology, not the MRI gang.
There are parts of the field that have major problems, like the sorts of studies that get done on 20 student volunteers and then get turned into a pop psychology factoid that gets tossed around and over-generalized while the original study fails to replicate, but there are parts that are actually good science.
Touting neuroscience as especially informed and scientific about minds is very brave.
Some quality sneers in Extropicās latest presentation about their thermodynamics hardware. My favorite part was the Founderās mission slide āe/acc maximizes the watts per civilization while Extropic maximizes intelligence per wattā.
is Extropic now claiming to have actually done anything?
Apparently they are going to ship their development kits sometime later this year. He still sounds confusing AF to me and my BS indicator is going off all the time. He also makes incorrect statements (around 9 minutes in) such as
Neural nets came from energy-based models
which makes 0 sense historically. According to Wikipedia, EBMs were first introduced in 2003.
Iām not going to watch more than a few seconds but I enjoyed how awkward Beff Jezos is coming across.
Hey look, itās this meme for the n-th time
