• Flying Squid@lemmy.world
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      1 year ago

      Examples of the singular “they” being used to describe someone features as early as 1386 in Geoffrey Chaucer’s The Canterbury Tales and also in famous literary works like Shakespeare’s Hamlet in 1599.

      “They” and “them” were still being used by literary authors to describe people in the 17th Century too - including by Jane Austin in her 1813 novel Pride and Prejudice.

      https://www.bbc.com/news/newsbeat-49754930

      But really, what would Chaucer, Shakespeare and Jane Austen know about the English language?

      • diprount_tomato@lemmy.world
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        1 year ago

        Aren’t those cases referring to individuals you don’t know the gender of? Like “I saw a silhouette moving, they were going somewhere”

        • Flying Squid@lemmy.world
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          1 year ago

          'Tis meet that some more audience than a mother, since nature makes them partial, should o’erhear the speech.

          • Hamlet, Act III, Scene 3

          There’s not a man I meet but doth salute me As if I were their well-acquainted friend

          • The Comedy of Errors, Act IV, Scene 3

          Sounds like the gender was known.

        • Chozo@kbin.social
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          1 year ago

          Yes, which is literally why many nonbinary people prefer “they” for their third person pronouns.

    • Chozo@kbin.social
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      1 year ago

      Did you notice that you have no problem using the gender-neutral pronoun “you” in this comment?

      It’s almost like this isn’t something you actually care about, but just see as something to justify irrational hatred of people. That’s kinda weird, lady.

      • superguy@lemm.ee
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        1 year ago

        I think the problem is those who have issues with the words ‘he and she.’

    • who8mydamnoreos@lemmy.world
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      1 year ago

      Why waste your time trying to define someone else’s identity. Let people be themselves; it’s none of your business anyway.

    • BlemboTheThird@lemmy.ca
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      1 year ago

      Trans and nonbinary people have existed for as long as humanity has. Your perception of this “stupidity” as new is the result of people finally overcoming hundreds of years of religious programming; bigotry that has been passed down for generations as superstitious fear anyone presenting in an unfamiliar way, and people are now more willing to express themselves as they actually feel, rather than as they feel they must in order to protect themselves.

      Here’s a short piece of a lecture by a Stanford professor explaining how wrong you are. https://youtu.be/8QScpDGqwsQ

    • HeartyBeast@kbin.social
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      1 year ago

      I don’t know what your gender is a a comment or, so I’m very happy to refer to you in a gender neutral way, as should be.

      As an ex journalist I’ve been using a gender neutral ‘they’ to refer to hypothetical people eg: ‘the applicant should attach their passport photo’ since the 1980s. It better than the ugly ‘his/her’.

      Keep in mind that yes, some non-binary people or trans folk do go to see a therapist - and the result is they come out being happy as non-binary or trans.

      Really, this isn’t the most important thing in the world. It’s just courteous to refer to people im the way that they like to be referred. Courtesy is good, yes?

      • diprount_tomato@lemmy.world
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        1 year ago

        Well, that’s because you don’t know or don’t care about the gender of the applicant, not because that applicant is non-binary

            • be_excellent_to_each_other@kbin.social
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              1 year ago

              Because they’re totally different uses of gender-neutral language

              OK, let’s go with that. Can you please help me understand what problem is created for you by someone being non-binary and wishing to be referred to as they?

              I understand that problem #1 is you are being asked to be respectful to someone you disagree with, but if we can get past that…?

              • diprount_tomato@lemmy.world
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                1 year ago

                I’d use “they/them” pronouns if I’m asked to out of respect to another human being, but that won’t make me stop thinking that usage is bs

    • NoneOfUrBusiness@kbin.social
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      1 year ago

      Bro this and that has literally nothing to do with each other. “They” has been used for when you don’t know the person’s gender since the 15th century.

      • superguy@lemm.ee
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        1 year ago

        How long has he and she been used when you do know the person’s gender?

          • superguy@lemm.ee
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            1 year ago

            Uhh, what?

            Looks like the people who have problems with ‘he and she’ are the ones who want something to be angry about.

      • diprount_tomato@lemmy.world
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        1 year ago

        Blocking someone won’t change anything, it’s just hiding your head under the sand and pretending it’s not real

        I will get blocked for this, but had to say that the guy will keep thinking the way he does. In fact, he will probably become more radical

    • be_excellent_to_each_other@kbin.social
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      1 year ago

      Not one problem in your life is the result of a person you know (or even a person you don’t know) wanting to be referred to as ‘they.’

      Not one.

      Edit: LOL of course it was JasSmith@kbin.social - so I guess you do have some problem that someone else’s pronouns have caused for you?

    • superguy@lemm.ee
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      1 year ago

      I’ve found America is pretty much the only nation where ideas like these have gotten hold.

      The rest of the word recognizes it for what it is and just decides to steer clear.