cross-posted from: https://midwest.social/post/30028880
Our policy initiatives and overall goal are slightly different than that of this sub, but we seek to have the largest tent that we can.
I believe incremental change is key, and although $12B may seem a ridiculously high wealth cap to a community arguing for a sub $1B cap, we hope you will look into our arguments.
A $12B cap has a much larger tent, as it only excludes 250 people in the world, and could be a first step in proving that wealth distribution is effective. By the numbers, people with $1B-$12B are not the driving issue of wealth inequality. If we can end the existence of major multi-billionaires all of humanity will be infinitely better off, whether they have a net worth of $1 or $1B
Lol, 12 billion dollar cap. That’s about the GDP of Somalia. Surely that will eradicate wealth inequality.
We are not focused on class war between the majority and the 1%, because (by the numbers) they are not the direct threat to the sustainability of the system. They are not where our money has gone to.
The difference between someone with even $12B and Musk level wealth is the difference between a single story house and a 36 story skyscraper. We are focused on tearing down the skyscraper and taxing the house appropriately. To be frank, the wealth of people with less than a billion dollars is not on our radar as a problem. In contrast, we would like their help in tearing down the skyscrapers. That is the point of our community. We are only after the excess wealth of 250 people in the world.
So again, I welcome you 100% to the tent if you are interested, but politically our goals will always remain simple and be augmented by simple arguments. If that means we are not the community for you, I understand. Were seeking to act rationally in pursuit of a more ethical world, not to demand ethical perfection from the outset. To be honest I personally believe that ethical perfectionism, infighting, and shrinking the tent are major reasons why progressive movements to rectify wealth inequality constantly fail
Louis Sachar once wrote an entire book based around the concept that “if you want to fight your way upstream in a river, you have to take small steps”. We arent looking at the end of the river, were looking at the first small steps. Also that book is a great sequel to Holes for anyone who has never heard of it
Our argument may seem reductive, but anyone with at least one functioning eyeball can see the simple nature of the problem. The skyscrapers are a head and shoulders above the single story house. Its a simple problem to see, and an exponential one. 6 people in the world owned half of all the money before covid. Now the problem is even worse. I would venture that the richest 250 people in the world probably own 3/4ths of all the money at this point, at least.
Money was made to move. When that money is parked it doesnt change hands. When it doesnt change hands it doesnt get taxed, things dont get bought. When that happens the government doesnt have the resources it needs, and the economy goes out of whack as well. Its a simple problem that ties into literally every issue imaginable just on that basis. Climate change? We could use more resources to fight it. Materials science to solve the plastic problem? More resources to fight it. People cant afford rent? More resources to pay them. People cant afford healthcare? Do you wish we had bridges to drive over that arent 60+ years old? Are you tired of paying for a fishing/hunting license to subsidize conservation? Everything big and small is impacted in some way by the wealth of the richest 250 people not moving, both inside the US and around the world.
The goal of the movement is not to change the system, really. We arent arguing for moving away from capitalism, even if many of us would like to see that. What we are arguing for is fixing the most unsustainable problem within the system we already have, so that we can continue to fight for a better system in general.
A primary goal is to keep the tent be as wide as is possible. The point being that we are fighting specifically on this one issue that should, at least hypothetically, bridge the gap between even people who want radical change and people who want to see no change at all. For people who want radical changes, this is the first step in the right direction. For people who want to see no change at all, this is a step that will prevent the collapse of what they dont want to see changed.
For anyone too broke to afford cost of living, this is what will raise them up to afford a base level of comfort. For the 1%ers, this is what will ensure they get to keep the standard of living they already have, as well as make a shit ton of money off the rest of us. If anything I see this community as an incubation for a political bridge party that can actually bring enough people under one tent to affect change, and breakthrough the various distractions that the richest people in the world rely on so we dont come after them. Red vs blue, black vs white, majority vs 1%ers, and so on and so forth. Its all just bullshit to keep us from paying attention to the 0.0001% who have almost all of the money.
We are focused on making the system we have, flawed as it is, a base level of sustainable in the interest of everybody. Regardless of what they would want to see next.
To analogize: if were all in one car together right now that is a hunk of shit, and we got a flat tire, the goal for us is to fix the tire so we can make it down the road. Some might want to abandon the car right now even if it means chaos. Some might want to fix the flat so we can get a different car. And some might want to fix the flat so we can keep driving the same hunk of shit. But the goal of our community would be centered on fixing the tire, to avoid chaos and to leave our options open for the future
That cap only affects to the top 0.0001% of richest americans. So it does matter because there are 10000 more people in the 1% than in the bracket your cap affects to. And you don’t even want to redistribute all their money, they could keep more money than they could spend in a thousand lives.
At this point I think you are larping because this is the most ridiculous thing I have seen trying to pass as a progressive initiative.
I dont know how to better explain the difference in magnitude of what kind of problem the existence of a hundred millionaire versus a mega billionaire is than I already have. Im more than aware the 1% includes anyone with over $13M. $13M is chump change in the grand scheme of things
I understand you personally are focused on all high level wealth. Simple math reveals that they are not where your buying power as an American wage earner went. Simple math shows that someone with $100M and someone with $10 are basically equally as poor as one another compared to even someone with $12B, let alone someone with $400B.
Do you understand? There really is no need to devolve into stupid personal attacks simply because you dont get my point. Im building a bridge initiative as a progressive. Not trying to build an idealized progressive initiative, like the many I have watched come and go as a progressive individual. Progressive hardly even means one specific thing in the first place anyways
No, you don’t know how to do math.
Top 1% in USA has 42 trillion dollars. People with more than 12 billion dollars have a total of 3 trillion dollars, from which you want to let them remain with about 1 trillion.
So this cap only redistributes 2 trillion from the 1%, which is less than 5% of the wealth that they are hoarding. This doesn’t fix shit. Do you still not get it?
There are 813 billionaires in the US today. If we took away everything above $12B from them, we would start moving the roughly $5T they are sitting on while still leaving them with $1B-$12B each.
You are bringing up a completely different subject than what I referred to, which is that the 1% includes all net worths of $13M or more.
This conversation isnt about redistribution of much of anything from the 1% at large. Its about dislodging the 5 trillion dollars that sit largely in the hands of like 10 people. Just that $5T moving would be enough to allow the rest of the 1% unaffected. Thats like 1/3rd of the federal deficit
I fail to see where my math has been wrong at any point. The point of targeting that $5T specifically is because its $5T that is virtually guaranteed to never move otherwise. Its just feel good money for the mega billionaires, which even 1%er cant relate to or justify