As noted by the news release from CalyxOS and Mastodon thread from GrapheneOS, Google did not release the Pixel device-specific source code alongside their Android 16 AOSP release like they usually do. I think many of us, including myself, are hoping this will be published in the near future, but considering they moved AOSP development behind closed doors earlier this year, it’s more likely Google has stopped publishing this section or their code altogether, making development of custom ROMs for Pixel devices significantly more difficult. Sad news for the Android ecosystem, and for open source in general.
Terrible news ofc, but I hope no one panic buys a different phone or anything (assuming they already have one). This is just to say, your phone isn’t immediately obsoleted right now, so give it a little while before you switch anything out.
What about someone currently on a Googled version of Android on a non-pixel that want to get a privacy smartphone?
While this was an inevitable move, it makes me curious if they are hitting a point where Gemini is becoming so integrated in all their software stacks and they’re just insanely paranoid about any precious “AI” code leaking that they just decided to close the gates early.
Probably for the best long-term. Having this weird dependency on the generosity of a corporation was always a liability. Whatever comes next can hopefully avoid it.
Hopefully someone like the EU, to combat ewaste, eventually requires all hardware manufacturers to sell their mobile hardware with bootloader/firmware flashing unlocking requirements. The work then will be for the community to write support for all these various makes and models of device, but the endgame being actual device freedom. Although with the world seemingly leaning hard into Authoritarianism and Fascism, it might not end up being the right time and freedom will remain underground.
A pity too, all phone hardware at its core is generic ARM computers with various devices connected to fairly generic interface busses. They just encrypt bits of code so the sauce to make things work is hidden.
I remember a couple of months ago it was reported here that Google was making Android closed-source and I commented that this will be the end of custom rom’s and this was received by the community poorly as many stated that they would still be releasing the code but not their AOSP apps (or something like that) but I already see the writing on the wall. Google doesn’t want to be open-source, they where in the past because that gave them free coders to fix their shit and make them more profitable, but now they just want our data and the open-source community is against that, so they are closing doors to the community in order to be able to truly make money with people’s information. Wouldn’t surprise me if the next Pixel in the works is going with a similar approach as the iPhone and only allow for an eSim as well.
that Google was making Android closed-source
That’s disinformation.
From reading the rest:
- You released misinformation ( Google is just open sourcing the releases, but not the dev builds of AOSP. nothing about Apps, nothing about Closed sourcing)
- You failed to read the comments on your post and imagined something here again
- And now go on a rant about eSims.
To be honest, I think the problem here is not Google, but your inability to read.
theres more profit to be like apple.
Google is slowly closing access to everything. It’s a boiled frog situation. All the red flags are there. We’re fucked.
keep the faith - we are not fucked, we just need to move to different systems entirely.
There is currently no alternative to android. Every alternative is both less secure and less usable.
As Android continues to enshitify more people will be interested in alternatives, which will drive support.
If there were other systems I’d be using them already.
The complexity of getting the closed binary blobs to run modems and other hardware will make it exceedingly difficult to extract the necessary files and configurations to keep third-party OSes afloat. Then there’s the matter of carrier configs, carrier compatibility, expensive carrier certification, and even then, carriers may still just ban the device because they don’t like it.
Options will end up being:
- Tearing apart ROMs for blobs and backport/reverse-engineering patches to make them run on alt OSes.
- Find some hardware based on janky Chinese modems that will have little band support, lackluster performance, and likely banned by most carriers.
- Start a new company with the pull to design a new phone OS and hardware with chip and carrier support.
Not impossible, just exceedingly difficult. These systems are heavily integrated and heavily proprietary.
Funny part is, this move will actually make Google lose more money, as Google will lose hardware/software sales, and software dev over this. More people will end up on iOS in the interim, and out of it will come some new mobile OS that will make Google’s mobile OS irrelevant in 10 years.
Let’s start now, start a company, base a new phone on QNX, have an Android emulation layer for apps until a proper SDK is developed, and just take the wind out of Google sooner than later.
Linux phones are looking more attractive every day now.
I’m using an Ubuntu touch device as my main driver these days (currently on volla Quintus)
It’s good, but it’s not there yet in terms of ease of use. If you’re not a Linux enthusiast, you will likely have a bad time on UT (can’t comment on sailfish, though I’d imagine it suffers in a similar way).
The largest problem is app support… By a mile. Most apps I use are just web apps I’ve had to manually setup. You can emulate an android and boot into it with waydroid, which will allow you to install apks; But honestly that feels like a cop out… which is why I try to make use of web apps where I can. (It also destroys your battery life… As you’re essentially running two phones).
I figured it’s not quite there yet. I hope market forces will solve this eventually. If Google manages to make android bad enough, demand for an alternative should arise. I’m already running Linux on my desktop quite happily, thanks to windows 11.
Yeah I think you’re right. This will be the main drive behind adoption; even as an enthusiast I was sceptical to try a Linux phone; but google’s predatory policies ultimately forced my hand; it’s only a matter of time before more end up feeling like they have no choice.
Android isn’t the bastion of open source freedom it once was. We need a new (or GNU heheh) approach.
This is really concerning for the Android ecosystem.
It will make development much harder and slower for CalyxOS and Graphene - which is very bad news as they are tiny teams.
As I understand it this affects all models to a degree, even Fairphone, as source code for Pixels made it easier to see how code could be adapted to support new Android features/APIs/etc for third party phones.
Whelp guess I’ll be hoping Linux phones rapidly improve in quality and availability.
Less reason to buy a Pixel, then.
Which would help how? If they are really going to make it much more difficult for custom roms it doesn’t matter what phone you choose.
Uhg then what? Samsung’s got too much of their own shit data harvesting crap on top of the Google stuff. All other phones basically have shit cameras. Time to go to iPhone? Seems they’re all the same at this point 😜
Sideloaded apks are the only difference left.
If you’re in Europe, Fairphone is an option. I’m pretty happy with mine.
Graphene is centered around security. I’ve heard bad things about Fairphone in that regard - the Graphene team even talks about them in the replies on that thread.
Respectfully to the Graphene team, they say that about literally every other OS.
Read their comment and I’m left scratching my head. Their role in security with the straight android phone (not the /e/OS version) is simply pushing security patches as/when they get them from the Android team, as they’re using straight Android. Security is handled by Google for Android, not them. When it comes to /e/OS, no idea how good/bad it is, but apparently Graphene has some beef with Murena (the people who make it), at least according to their comment.
Not at all knowledgable about mobile kernels and drivers to comment on the rest of it. I do know Fairphone 5 uses an unusual CPU normally used for SoC as that was the only CPU that was both good enough to run Android reasonably while simultaneously providing very long-term driver updates (they’re aiming for a minimum of 8 years of updates).
I can’t speak to beef, but there is more to Android security than what Google provides. That’s what Graphene is for, to make Android even more secure through hardening various attack surfaces and introducing other completely new security features. If that weren’t the case, Graphene wouldn’t be necessary on Pixels because Google does monthly security patching for them.
It’s also at the firmware level, which Google does not provide except for on their own hardware, and on top of that Google phones are some of the only ones capable of providing some security feature at the hardware level. This seems to be the main thing the Graphene team is trying to point out.
Their role in security with the straight android phone…is simply pushing security patches as/when they get them from the Android team
If that were true there would be no reason to use GOS. The entire point is that they introduce new privacy and security options into the OS.
You heard stuff? What stuff specifically? Care to elaborate and provide sources?
The FairPhone is expensive and I’m not sure it can run Android Auto properly. If I can’t run my own OS anymore, Android will be an ugly alternative to the iPhone and I’d have to go back to iOS, it’s absolutely stupid from Google to do this.
Fairphone is not expensive. All the other phone are too cheap due to slave like labor both in the raw materials and production of the phones. Fairphone pays every one along the production chain fairly.
Why can’t you run your own OS anymore? You don’t have to buy a Pixel. This news is about Pixel phones, one of the many many many Android phones…
The discussion is about this being the first step to Google closing the source more broadly
Sony mostly pass the camera quality test†, the “fit and finish” test, and ship a relatively clean Android OS.
You also get options to have otherwise-long-forgotten features like 3.5mm headphone jacks and MicroSD slots, and Sony’s waterproofing is second to none for phones that you wouldn’t naturally describe as “ruggedised”.
There are unavoidable issues around pricing (high) and availability (low), but by most of the metrics people would choose to measure phones’ quality, features, performance, etc, they are actually doing a great job with their products (at least now that they also offer a respectable duration of OS updates and support).
If you are looking for it too, they tend to be at the upper end of manufacturers for open-source code and documentation availability: https://developerworld.wpp.developer.sony.com/open-source/aosp-on-xperia-open-devices, though with that said due to the relatively small audience for their products, availability of other people’s custom ROMs will not necessarily be extensive.
I’m on my fourth of their phones (Z2 2014, XZ Premium 2017, 1ii 2020, 1vii 2025), every upgrade time I’ve looked around, and every time I’ve failed to find something I want to own more than another one.
† The caveat here is they’re highly skewed toward operator control; you’re very much expected to participate in the photo-taking process and I’m painfully aware that’s not what most people want these days. Low assistance provided, basically zero “AI” processing, just lots of rope with which to hang yourself. It’ll take beautiful pictures once you get accustomed to it though, whaddaya gonna do?
I had an XZ premium. If it hadn’t had an issue charging at the end I’d still be using it. The video was incredible.
I actually typo’d the original (corrected now), my 2nd was an XZP too. And also died of failed USB port.
I looked into how hard repairing it would be, and while parts were mostly available, having to take the entire phone apart (as the USB port assembly was the last piece to come out of the chassis) didn’t thrill me.
I actually did go through the repair as I have some experience in that area. The new port didn’t work either. I was rather upset.
Honestly if Google is going to close all their shit, then yeah, absolutely.
pretty much, i went with a oneplus, i bought it mint condition on a site, but im likely to get a brand new one in the future if reasonablly priced(the one i have was)
If it’s all going to be proprietary nonsense then we might as well support our local businesses, if you ask me.
Our local down the street phone building businesses?
Artisanal hand carved phones
Ya you know the ones, there’s a bunch, there’s… Uh… I’m drawing a blank.
So, hear me out, but what if we all go back to feature phones? Smart phones are convenient, but do the pro’s weigh more than the cons at this point? I am also including mental health into this btw.
“feature phones” all still run Android, to my knowledge.
Not all, but there are several ones with android
Which ones don’t? I’d be very interested.
Honestly is rare to find a feature phone that runs android around here as most run some other java based software.
In any case, here are 3 (although there are more):
The Doro runs MocorOS, which, while not Android, is closed-source and proprietary. So technically yes but I’m not sure it’s any better.
The Nokia runs KaiOS (AKA Android)
The Punkt seems like a suitable option. Although $300 seems like a difficult pill to swallow for such a simple device.
KaiOS is one alternative, it was FirefoxOS. It’s pretty sluggish though. Maybe on more decent hardware with some optimizations it’d have a possibility. A lot of Nokia feature phones run it.
KaiOS is Android.
Come to the Fruit side!
No. It’s not nearly as usable. I can’t get a proper browser, can’t get a wifi analyzer, can’t even get a different dialer or keyboard. On top of that there is all their nonsense with imessage and attempted vendor lock in. I had to use one for my work. It was an awful, constrained experience.
i went with a non-pixel phone, because of thier OBSESSION with AI-specific chips, and a non-samsung one. i just like OPR12 for its battery life among other amenities…
Running the so-called AI workloads on the edge is what we want. Especially if the alternative is to run them on google servers.
Bought a Pixel 7a for GrapheneOS recently. Wanted to buy a new Pixel tablet for the same. Too bad, no more Google hardware for me.
i almost got a 7, but look at how bad thier uses of exonys chip, battery drainage and obsession with AI, i went OP instead, a brand new OP will be my future purchase once this one craps out.
OP being what?
OnePlus probably.
Useless for GrapheneOS then. I’m in the market for a decent tablet soon (on a LineageOS Samsung right now), and effectively I’ll have to settle for a used Pixel tablet. Orelse it’s Linux tablet time, which is probably nonexistant as well.
the silver lining to all this - devs & users might start turning their attention to linux phones:
Are they ready for prime time? Because I’d love a Linux phone but it’s sounds like it’s be such a step back in usability. But perhaps that’s a feature
Not even close from what I’ve seen, basic stuff doesn’t work right.
Replying from Sailfish.
It’s a mixed bag. VoLTE is required in Australia (no 2G or 3G anymore) and SFOS does support it so that’s good, but for some reason calls are stuck on speakerphone as the earpiece speaker doesn’t work. The GPS lock is quite slow. I also don’t have working cameras, and every time I unplug the charger the phone reboots.
On the plus side, the Android app support is really good (though I still use native SFOS apps wherever possible, but for banking etc. its handy). I have no stability problems, its pretty rock solid bar for the charger issue. I’ve daily driven it since about October last year, and honestly if I could make private phone calls it would be perfectly fine for me.
I will note that community developed ports are available for other devices with potentially better hardware compatibility, but the Android app support is not included as it’s proprietary (though Waydroid exists as an alternative) and VoLTE support is touch and go on other devices.
In regards to the slow GPS lock, is it possible to switch the location provider to beacondb?
Yeah I’m in AU so that isn’t an amazing review. Hopefully they get there in a few years, I run Linux on desktop, servers and ebook reader and love it.
from my research these 3 are the most polished. (you also have mobian & postmarketos)
If you want something set up out of the box, I would buy the FLX or maybe sailfish.
(Ubuntu touch does not support encryption yet)
I believe both have android app support, but it does drain a bit more battery as its using waydroid.
Sailfish has Aliendalvik for android app support, it’s proprietary. I’ve read good things about it: https://blogs.gnome.org/jdressler/2023/12/20/a-dive-into-jolla-appsupport/
Isn’t SailFish a Russian outfit? Also, every time I’ve looked at their phones, they were either sold out or somehow unavailable. Are they still active?
No, AuroraOS is the Russian fork of Sailfish.
Sailfish was in kahoots with the developers of Aurora, but they split ties when Putin spat the dummy at Ukraine.
Personally I wouldn’t buy a Jolla C2, but if you can get your hands on an Xperia 10 (working features vary by version, my 10 IV is not too bad but the 10 III is more polished) or a device supported by one of the better community ports, it’s worth a go.
I havent even had one with grapheneos for a year yet, what the fuck google…
Same. It’s about a year for me. And it’s not like the phones are cheap.
You’ve got to be kidding me man, I wanted to buy a phone that I could put a custom ROM on for years to come, I originally got an ASUS Zenfone for the same reason, and JUST as I get them both, they start locking things down. At least I was able to get lineage on my pixel for now, but who knows about updates!
Without this source, lineage is cooked too.
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I got one a few months ago. I guess the updates will stay for the next 5/7 years (shitty guess) as long as GrapheneOS stays on Android 15, but my next phone will not be a Pixel if Google does shit like that.
Google just lost themselves 900€
I bought a cheap Pixel 8a, no need to pay the full price unless you need big emulators.
Get a FairPhone with /e/OS. Give money to people who actually want to see an open ecosystem, not lock it down.
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Oh sweet! a question then for you: can you explain what the FairPhone is missing in terms of security? Do you maybe have notes comparing it to the Pixel? As a security layman, I’m curious.
There is a fairly all-or-nothing-security group of people within the GrapheneOS community. They will defend using a Google device on the claim of enhanced security.
Security is nice, but I’ll take a hit to security if it means I get to support the growth of an ecosystem that respects the user.
Much like their “no longer recommended” older pixels, it feels like they could likely continue to provide OS updates well into future Android versions. However, without access to the device-specific releases they may begin to lag behind on firmware updates
I won’t jump to conclusions yet as the OG announcement causes fears that grapheneOS team weren’t worried about… But I for sure don’t like where this is heading.
Edit: https://aussie.zone/post/21515124 Disregard, i should know better than being a optimist…
What’s with the universal images that Android got support to several years ago? I thought that would stop the need of having custom device code.
GSI can be functional but they frequently break something in my experience . Tried using GSI for my Xiaomi phones and they often lead to problems such as the camera and 5G not working properly.
