I am a Norwegian. Norway is a part of EFTA, but not the EU.

I am currently pro EU, but also fairly pro socialism, or at the very least pro social democracy.

I want Norway to have the security guarantees the EU offers, I want the same currency, I want Norway to be able to participate in changing EU, not just accepting something Brussels have decided without our participation (EFTA). And several other reasons.

We can currently veto implementing some decisions, but not too many.

If Norway joins the EU will it make it harder for Norway to transition to socialism/maintain social democracy?

  • PolandIsAStateOfMind@lemmy.ml
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    1 day ago

    Is EU membership compatible with a country becoming socialist?

    No, absolutely not, EU was created as a neoliberal program. Remember what they done to Greece at the mere shadow of threat Greece not even becoming socialist but merely trying to make a tiny crack in neolib austerity dogma.

  • Cowbee [he/they]@lemmy.ml
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    24 hours ago

    Norway will not be able to transition to Socialism through reformism. Social Democracy is incapable of swapping the balance of power from Capitalists to Workers. Norway depends on Imperialism, as does the rest of the Global North. As this weakens over time, so too will social services. The only path to Socialism for Norway, to have the public sector as the principle aspect of the economy and the Working Class in control, is revolution.

    The EU is Imperialist, but thoroughly dependent on the US, and as such are tied to the fate of the US.

  • BJHanssen@lemmy.world
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    1 day ago

    The EU was designed from the start to be a liberal market for the US in Europe. The trim has changed over the years, but the foundation has not. For a country like Norway, joining the EU would be a terrible decision as it would put us in a similar position as France and Germany without any real control over domestic fiscal policy. Joining the Euro would see us lose control over monetary policy.

    If this just meant our democratic voice being added to European democracy, that would be one thing. But that is not the case. The EU lacks democracy in the same way the moon lacks oxygen; it would be foolish to think it ought to be there to begin with. In the words of former German fonance minister Wolfgang Schäuble, ‘elections cannot be allowed to change economic policy’.

  • mumblerfish@lemmy.world
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    1 day ago

    Undermining the private market is usually forbidden in the EU. For example, Italy tried to add a government start-up subsidy to cooperatives to make them more competative. This is illegal for nations to do as it disfavours the private market.

      • mumblerfish@lemmy.world
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        8 hours ago

        It was a long time since I read about it. I think it was on wikipedia, some article on co-ops or democratic ownership or something like that, which referenced a EU court case with that conclusion.

  • freagle@lemmygrad.ml
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    1 day ago

    Socialism and social democracy are diametrically opposed. Social democracy is capitalism managing its captive populace through concessions to avoid socialism.

  • edel@lemmy.ml
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    1 day ago

    Socialism has so many interpretations is hard to say.

    Up to 8yrs ago, I would encourage any country with same “values” as the EU to join, I was an EU vociferous fan, now just an European one … The EU has become something rotten and the values it held dear are no longer there. The EU disciplines countries that does not follow what the establishment wants and discriminates to what states rules applies and to who does not. For instance, member states are encouraged to incarcerate certain journalists for months without even charges and the powers of the Commission become more and more without any mandate, let alone debate. You tell me who when the EU citizens completely overturned their representatives for Brussels, these still voted for Ursula von der Leyen… in no parliamentary system in the democratic world that could be possible! In the EU it does. Member states, for better or for worse, have veto power… well, no for some now… and you can even now can punish them! What you think it will happen to “socialist Norway” if it dissent?

    Stay out of the EU while the current status persist. So also from the Euro.

    Do work, however, to get Norway out of NATO. It is perplexing why a voluntary military alliance exert so much power in internal politics, but it does to a horrendous degree. NATO would be the one to first prevent Norway to become a Socialist country and in very nasty ways behind the scene,

      • edel@lemmy.ml
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        19 hours ago

        There are several but this comes to mind: Assange rape cases from Sweden you really, really think were real? The infiltration by US with the aid of UK and Spain in a embassy you think was normal? The forcing him to plead guilty to let him live does sound okay to the EU member states?

        But let me tell you other case of another journalist (and there are more!): “It is unacceptable for an EU member state to detain a journalist in such an arbitrary manner. Not only are Pablo González’s fundamental rights as a citizen and as a journalist being violated, but so is the freedom of the press and the public’s right to know,”
        He was arrested in Poland but his Spanish government officials did not lift a finger for him or any EU country for that matter. He was in solitary confinement for 2 years and 5 months with no contact with any family member whatsoever. No charges were ever filed. He was covering the Ukraine refugee crisis for several Spanish media like LaSexta. His crime? having a Russia father so been able to speak Russian to cover a Russian speaking region. How dare an important media ever send a journalist that can speak the local language! I love the framing the media said at the time though… “he was carrying two passports with different names” and reminded me of the multitude ¨terrorists" arrests after 9/11 and the press saying “they had multiple passports” and “a flight simulators was found”… until I realized which young immigrant in the US would not have multiple passports and have one of the most popular games in the 90s! The two passports with “different names” it is rather common for people with dual citizenship to have different names… there is nothing illegal or fishy about it. Here in the US it is even in the forms to change name as you gain the citizenship! He was born in Russia but lived all his live in Spain (a very commi side of Spain though, I give you that) but not deserving to imprison in solitary confinement for 2 and a half years without any charges to be released in a prisoner exchange with Russia.

        https://www.ifj.org/media-centre/news/detail/category/europe/article/poland-spanish-journalist-pablo-gonzalez-in-custody-for-two-years-on-charges-of-spying-for-russia

        By the way, after years of reading on spies’ arrests by, whether is Poland, Russia, Iran, US or India, in today’s world, with so much tech and the resources that these countries have to accumulate evidence… if a “spy” is arrested and no charges are brought up within 2 months and 5 in front of a judge, I straight consider it either there is no case at all, or the government it is just accumulating a head count to exchange with another country. I don´t even think 70% of the “prisonerś exchanges” are what they claimed they are. Now, if they pick people randomly or simply people they don´t like it is a mystery.