Spain suffered several power glitches and industry officials sounded repeated warnings about the instability of its power grid in the build up to its catastrophic blackout on Monday.

The government has ordered several investigations into the blackout. Industry experts say that whatever the cause, the mass outage and earlier smaller incidents indicate the Spanish power grid faces challenges amid the boom of renewables.

A surplus of energy supply can disrupt power grids in the same way as a deficit, and grid operators must maintain balance.

  • 🦄🦄🦄@feddit.org
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    2 days ago

    Btw this means spain needs to upgrade its grid, not that they should use less renerable or continue with nuclear.

    • FurryMemesAccount@lemmy.blahaj.zone
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      2 days ago

      What does “upgrade the grid” mean to you?

      Digging tons of rock and salts to store energy with batteries?

      In Europe there are very few remaining sites to build hydro power, and those have serious ecological consequences too… I don’t see to many alternatives. Biogas options are nearly tapped out. There is potential with geothermal using new digging techniques, but they’re mostly in the testing stage still.

      How is using batteries better than using said rocks to power nuclear reactors?

      There is a limit to how much one can add uncontrollable energy sources to a grid…

      • Knock_Knock_Lemmy_In@lemmy.world
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        2 days ago

        You listed storage and sources of energy. I’m not saying there can’t be improvements there, but the Grid is the transmission network used to carry the electricity.

        More power lines, more/better interconnections with other countries (France). Better load management. That sort of thing.

        • FurryMemesAccount@lemmy.blahaj.zone
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          2 days ago

          Yes, I only listed means to store or produce energy because upgrading powerlines won’t fix power fluctuations : that is due to imbalances between production and consumption, no amount of upgraded to transmission capacity is likely to help.

          Load management might help, however. But it’s typically hard to get people to consume more when needed and power shedding is expensive on the electrical operator… Especially since those oscillations were unexpected. Also those things already exist in many European countries.

          • Knock_Knock_Lemmy_In@lemmy.world
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            1 day ago

            upgrading powerlines won’t fix power fluctuations :

            It can certainly help

            that is due to imbalances between production and consumption,

            Those imbalances are usually localised (and so are power cuts, usually). Having multiple paths for power to get from generation to load will increase stability.

            no amount of upgraded to transmission capacity is likely to help.

            Better connections between Spain and France is certain to help. But EDF don’t want cheap Iberian electricity flooding their export markets.

      • Aceticon@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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        2 days ago

        Solar is generated as a DC current which has to be converted to AC and the grid voltage (so, 220V in Spain) in order to supply it to the energy grid, so all that it takes to control the flow of energy from solar generation into the grid is to be able to remotely tell the DC-AC converters of the solar farms to stop sending power to the AC side. When the converters are in that state, energy is not flowing down to the energy grid and all that happens on the other side is that the solar cells get a bit more warm.

        Of course that means it has to mandatory for any solar supplier to the mains network to have a converter which can be switched off remotely by the grid management company.

        Similarly, wind generation can be reduced and even stopped by changing the pitch of the blades and similarly it must be possible for the grid management company to do so remotely.

        Switching on and off power sources (for example, switching on or off power turbines in dams or gas power stations) has long been how the grid management company balances production with consumption in order to avoid blackouts.

        The problem is not an inherent inability of the new forms of renewable generation to be reduced or stopped when needed, it’s that if not forced the businesses generating that energy won’t pay the extra money to have systems in placed to do so which can be remotely activated by the electric grid management company: the flow of renewable energy is not controllable because the power supply operators won’t spend the money into making it controllable unless forced and at least until now there was no political will to force them to do so.

        It’s a political (and Capitalism) problem, not a technical problem.