A recent event led me to fact check something that I thought must be untrue, which is that Ukraine conscripts people into the military against their will, including making those people that had previously fulfilled their obligations return to the battlefield.
Moreso, when browsing X recently I saw bunch of videos being posted of what claimed were police forcing people into vans to go fight in Ukraine. The police were beating these people in the process. Now, it is possible that some of this content is propaganda, but I did want to find out if Ukraine forces conscription.
It appears that it is true:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conscription_in_Ukraine
I am very much against conscription. I still support Ukraine’s independence, but the fact that they are forcing people to fight through beatings, arrests, etc. is sickening to me and makes me lose respect for Zelensky. According to an estimate by Ukrainian commanders, 50% to 70% of Ukrainian conscripts are killed or wounded in their first few days in combat on some areas of the front.
What are others thoughts on this?
I bring up conscription because I’m opposed to it, that is why. That includes Russia doing it, but Ukraine is supposed to be the democracy not the dictatorship. I’m not going to look at this & think to myself, well Russia is worse so even if Ukraine started force-breeding women to create more future soldiers then it is okay cause Russia is bad. I can understand Putin is a fascist dictator, but Ukraine forcing people to war through kidnapping/beating/jail/etc. is not good either.
I agree with what you’re saying. I’m just trying to contextualize why I responded as I did. Tensions are high, I meant nothing personal.
To my earlier point, I saw this happen with a Ukrainian ex who I spoke with the day Russia started to bomb. I urged her to do everything possible to leave, but her mother refused. Her brother was expected to stay and fight, her mom wouldn’t leave her brother. It’s brutal. On the one hand, what do you do if you’re Ukraine? Roll over and let Russia progress, so even more people die? Hand over your country? Ideally you could count on your allies to help, but seeing as one country’s population is being asked to shoulder the burden, I’m really not sure what to make of it all.
In World War II Europe and the US were democracies that relied on conscription to save democracy and defeat dictatorships.
And they were still bad for doing that.
Yeah, stopping the Nazis turned out bad for everyone. Dumbest fucking statement.
Ripping apart a baby to bring the rain is a bad thing regardless of whether or not it rains. Kidnapping kids under threat of decades of torture and telling them to kill or be killed is bad regardless of whether or not it stops the Nazis.
Forced conscription is a crime on the level of genocide, because often that’s what results.
Oh fuck off with that self righteous shit. You’d have to be a complete idiot to make this argument. You have to be really young to still think you can make this argument and not look naive and stupid.
No, I value freedom over something as stupid as a country. If the country is worth defending, people will volunteer.
Kidnapping them and sending them to their death is pure evil regardless of the reason. There is no justification. If your country does that, it deserves and needs to be wiped off the face of the planet.
It’s not naive to value human life over a nation.
What freedom if we lost that war? And the Jewish people who would have been exterminated if it went on? The disabled the queer people? Sounds like you only value certain lives.
You’re standing on an imaginary soap box, and you can only do that because those people were sent to war.
That’s great and all, but your criticism needs to be redirected at yourself. Gay people aren’t gods. Neither are Jews. Neither are disabled people.
They are not ubermensch to which we should sacrifice our children to unwillingly.
They are not special. No one is.
If your cause is great you’ll have no problem finding volunteers for your war. If not the cause wasn’t that great. You don’t get to tell others how they should die or what they should fight for. The right of life and death over themselves is the only true right that humans have, and violating that right is the most evil thing; whether it is murder, genocide, or conscription ending in either.
Nazis are awful, they deserve to die. I’ll probably die fighting them based on my class and characteristics. But forcing someone in front of their bullets for my life would make me as evil as they are.