I think I know the answer but just trying to get more definitive. It’s been difficult for me to see the difference. It seems to be the same ideology at the end of the day. The only difference seems to be that Zionism (most forms) stay localized rather than claim racial superiority for the whole world. But maybe not?

  • Anarcho-Bolshevik@lemmygrad.ml
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    1 year ago

    That’s a good question. There were fascist Zionists, and there are certainly neofascist strands in Zionism today, but it is an exaggeration to refer to Zionism per se as fascist. Rather, Zionism is colonialist, just like Fascism was. Fascism was the militarist, predominantly petty‐bourgeois movement that the haute‐bourgeoisie promoted to institutional power in order to strengthen capitalism, which involved eliminating the proletariat’s concessions. Colonialism was also part of the job, though, as the Fascists inherited a colonial empire and were outraged when the Entente failed to give the Kingdom of Italy more land as reward for helping win WWI.

    Zionism emerged from the same soil, not just geographically but also in terms of how it likewise recommended colonialism by any means necessary. It was (and still is) a capitulation to antisemitism: the Zionists believed that Jews and gentiles were incompatible, so separatism was necessary and Jews had to settle in Patagonia, Uganda, or Palestine. The Zionists wanted a formidable neocolony, but not necessarily a superpower that could compete with other empires.

    Compared to the Fascists, who were adventurer‐conquerors, the Zionists were and still are much less ambitious. As far as I know, the Zionists haven’t tried to extinguish class‐consciousness through a merciless crackdown on proletarian organizations either (unless the organizations were Palestinian).

    That said, the régime has been unafraid to grant neofascists some political power (similar to how the Kingdom of Italy and the Weimar Republic allowed fascists in parliaments), and early on it did receive support from the Fascist empires, so I think that it is at least easy to understand why people consider Zionism per se fascist even if it be an exaggeration. For now, I believe that ‘parafascist’ would be an accurater description of the neocolony.

    • Idliketothinkimsmart@lemmygrad.ml
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      1 year ago

      but it is an exaggeration to refer to Zionism per se as fascist. Rather, Zionism is colonialist

      Seems like a bit of a chicken vs the egg scenario. I get that “fascism” might have a specific scientific definition, but does it ultimately matter if Zionism is only achievable through the removal of Palestinian people from their land?

      Also, the ambitiousness/ the lack thereof of the Zionist regime doesn’t really seem as important in determining whether zionism is inherently fascist or not. At that point, we’d be left with splitting hairs about every invasion/ foreign assassination/ destabilization Israeli has carried out.

      I mean, Israel has outlawed Jewish-Arab antiwar rallies as well, and they do repress the Antizionist Jews in Israel. They’re not necesarilly “proletariat” party rallies/ bases, but they are ultimately more progressive than what is currently in the current regime. Even then, I’m sure communists in Israel-proper get visits from the IDF we don’t hear about.

      • QueerCommie@lemmygrad.ml
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        1 year ago

        Isntreal, as a bourgeois settler nation has basically no proletariat to repress.

        Seems like a bit of a chicken vs the egg scenario. I get that “fascism” might have a specific scientific definition, but does it ultimately matter if Zionism is only achievable through the removal of Palestinian people from their land?

        If fascism is simple [settler?] colonialism then it’s existed since 1492. I think it’s worth making some sort of distinction. There is no “scientific definition” but there is surely some distinction, like reviving imperial past and suppressing the proletariat (as discussed). I’m wondering whether the early Jewish god backed genocides in the Old Testament/Torah could be considered parallel to pre WWI Germany.