A photograph of a short-eared owl mid-flight was the last Instagram post biology professor Carl Bergstrom shared before announcing his departure from the platform Jan. 10.
I’m on both and Mastodon is missing (at least in any easy to use way) most of the features that make Bluesky such a good destination:
instant add subscribe lists
subscribable block lists
custom feeds/subscribable algorithms
keyword/topic blocks
nuclear block where you never see the blocked person again
optional discover feed
DM preferences
All these things (and more I’m sure I’m forgetting), make Bluesky very quick to get started with and very powerful for honing your feeds to be exactly how you want and free of harassment and trolling.
I am still trying with Mastodon, but it’s really slow going and I can fully understand why people wouldn’t bother. After a year I am way behind where I was in a week with Bluesky.
Not sure what nuclear block means but I can’t think of any way a blocked person could be seen again. It even has above nuclear blocking where you block their entire server.
It has custom feeds but the implementation with lists is very fiddly and I wish it would be improved.
There is a trending posts section but I think you want a personalised discover feed? Which will never happen of course.
Thanks for the update. Yes the recommended feed is personalized. It’s optional. The main feed has no algorithm, just who you follow.
Keyword blocking is a bit more sophisticated on Bluesky I think as they have a crowdsourced tagging system which allows you to opt in an out also of tagged words regardless of whether they appear in the body of the post.
The tagging sounds great. One of the problems with masto is showing the hashtags in the body making posts that use them look awful, and of course being entirely set by the author
Yes the recommended feed is personalized. It’s optional. The main feed has no algorithm, just who you follow.
The thing is, a lot of social media sites have or had this. YouTube has the subscriptions feed. Twitter has (I don’t know anymore) a following feed. Reddit used to keep posts on your homepage only being from subscribed subreddits.
One problem. People don’t use them. They see maintaining subscriptions as work and so want to be fed posts by algorithm.
Been watching @TechConnectify 's latest?! He has some interesting stats on the subscriptions feed on YT in there - and yes, it’s shockingly low.
I think people want plug and play. Maintaining subs isn’t work as such after you’ve set it up, but it does take that initial setup. https://youtu.be/QEJpZjg8GuA
Thanks for the list! As someone who has never used any Twitter-like site before (I guess microblog is the right term…?), and recently made a profile on Bluesky only to support it (I have used it briefly ~3 times since joining): what are the pros of Mastodon that Bluesky doesn’t have?
Haha, thanks! I know it’s quite important for a good bunch of people here (on a federated site), but I guess I’ll stick with Bluesky then. Thanks for the insights! : )
It’s important because, along with the ability to migrate accounts, it prevents/deters enshittification. In betting Bluesky will hit that wall in the next few years (I’m guessing they’ll never properly implement federation).
Yeah I agree that we will probably happen, but the problem is using Mastodon is such a pain for the vast majority of people, it’s not worth the hassle.
And I say that to someone who uses both platforms.
I know; as much as I love the concept, I can already see .world soaking up most of the users, which might not be the best thing for federation - but TBF when I came over from Reddit, my main goal was to find something decent and similar, and federation was secondary at best for me; so I’ll see if it gets any worse, but for the moment, the first list definitely overweighs the second “list” for me.
Bluesky’s main feed is totally algorithm free, it’s just the people you follow’s posts in chronological order, same as mastodon.
Starter kits are optional, but they allow you to get started in hours rather than months. For me, they made the difference between a vibrant and interesting feed well tailored towards my interests, and a very sparse feed that I didn’t use on Mastodon. For me they were the difference between a useful social network and a non-useful one.
Main one is that it doesn’t manipulate your feed with stuff “you might enjoy” so you can’t be easily manipulated by the people setting the algorithm. Of course, this is exactly why people find it hard. People want to be fed stuff and told what to consume.
There’s a new option available now for reply controls, you can limit it to just people who follow you. While it’s a very low bar, it’s enough of a threshold for most randoms to not bother following just to reply to you
And even without that, I still have felt that the quality of replies doesn’t drop THAT much one it hits Discover - but it may be partly who I follow/am recommended, that block lists are doing a great job of eliminating trolls+spam, and I just automatically ignore any stupid/low effort stuff (“wow you are the best at that thing you posted about”, “that js amazjng i have never seen a linux before” or whatever).
This one is so important. After a year my mastodon feed is perfectly tailored for me. When I open it I enjoy my time there and the posts I see. I can leave whenever I want, and without a feel of rage or anxiety. But the most important part is that I don’t feel the compulsive need to open it every other second. It’s to liberating in contrast with the algorithm led manipulation.
That’s not really a fair description of what’s going on.
There is absolutely nothing wrong with a recommendation algorithm, can you imagine trying to use Netflix if it didn’t tell you about any of the shows and you just have to guess and type in a film in order to see if it existed?
The problem with algorithms is when they’re the only option, or when they are invisible and you think you are getting a timeline of people you’ve subscribed to, but really you’re getting an algorithm optimizing retention. As long as it’s just recommending stuff there’s nothing wrong with it, in fact as a lot of people point out, it’s kind of necessary.
The world functioned before recommendation algorithms. Even the internet did. Once upon a time, when Goggle worked, it didn’t modify its results based on your history.
Netflix could operate fine with classifications, ratings good tagging and search. It doesn’t need to monitor your viewing habits and recommend something based on them.
Yes but it would be more irritating to use than without which is my point.
The world function perfectly well without electricity but I don’t think anyone is seriously suggesting that we go back to a pre-electrified age just because technically it’s possible.
over time I’ll probably end up moving over to Lemmy tbh. I think I’d prefer more of a forum vibe. I was never a Redditor so I didn’t “get” it until I started following Lemmy feeds.
In a word, audience. I’d prefer it if everyone went with Mastodon, but the audience on BlueSky is orders of magnitude bigger. I cross post to both, but only because I don’t trust BlueSky not to do exactly what Twitter and Meta have done eventually.
I think there’s a fairly serious problem for large accounts on mastodon but I will never have one so I can’t quite understand it myself.
Something like dealing with replies / scolds without spending all day blocking is too hard.
It doesn’t help that “no algorithm” means “show first reply at the top” so quick replies can dominate comments.
The bit I don’t understand is why this is fine on blue sky. Is it just different users? I can’t quite believe that but I can’t see why blue sky would be less annoying.
You could spin one up this evening if you wanted. Or go use catodon.social.
That’s not the point. The point is, there are reasons Mastodon is being rejected, just like there are reasons you seemingly cannot pay people to use a Misskey-based or Hubzilla-based website.
It’s not where the people are going, and the public or semi-public figures are going to follow the people.
Why switch to BlueSky if you have Mastodon…
I’m on both and Mastodon is missing (at least in any easy to use way) most of the features that make Bluesky such a good destination:
All these things (and more I’m sure I’m forgetting), make Bluesky very quick to get started with and very powerful for honing your feeds to be exactly how you want and free of harassment and trolling.
I am still trying with Mastodon, but it’s really slow going and I can fully understand why people wouldn’t bother. After a year I am way behind where I was in a week with Bluesky.
It does have keyword blocking.
Not sure what nuclear block means but I can’t think of any way a blocked person could be seen again. It even has above nuclear blocking where you block their entire server.
It has custom feeds but the implementation with lists is very fiddly and I wish it would be improved.
There is a trending posts section but I think you want a personalised discover feed? Which will never happen of course.
Thanks for the update. Yes the recommended feed is personalized. It’s optional. The main feed has no algorithm, just who you follow.
Keyword blocking is a bit more sophisticated on Bluesky I think as they have a crowdsourced tagging system which allows you to opt in an out also of tagged words regardless of whether they appear in the body of the post.
The tagging sounds great. One of the problems with masto is showing the hashtags in the body making posts that use them look awful, and of course being entirely set by the author
Yeah it makes it look like a 4chan post.
The thing is, a lot of social media sites have or had this. YouTube has the subscriptions feed. Twitter has (I don’t know anymore) a following feed. Reddit used to keep posts on your homepage only being from subscribed subreddits.
One problem. People don’t use them. They see maintaining subscriptions as work and so want to be fed posts by algorithm.
Been watching @TechConnectify 's latest?! He has some interesting stats on the subscriptions feed on YT in there - and yes, it’s shockingly low.
I think people want plug and play. Maintaining subs isn’t work as such after you’ve set it up, but it does take that initial setup. https://youtu.be/QEJpZjg8GuA
Yes. Yes I have.
I use them. I use platforms more that have them. I leave platforms that don’t.
But to each their own I guess.
Thanks for the list! As someone who has never used any Twitter-like site before (I guess microblog is the right term…?), and recently made a profile on Bluesky only to support it (I have used it briefly ~3 times since joining): what are the pros of Mastodon that Bluesky doesn’t have?
As far as I can tell, the advantages of Mastodon over Bluesky are:
Haha, thanks! I know it’s quite important for a good bunch of people here (on a federated site), but I guess I’ll stick with Bluesky then. Thanks for the insights! : )
It’s important because, along with the ability to migrate accounts, it prevents/deters enshittification. In betting Bluesky will hit that wall in the next few years (I’m guessing they’ll never properly implement federation).
Yeah I agree that we will probably happen, but the problem is using Mastodon is such a pain for the vast majority of people, it’s not worth the hassle.
And I say that to someone who uses both platforms.
I know; as much as I love the concept, I can already see .world soaking up most of the users, which might not be the best thing for federation - but TBF when I came over from Reddit, my main goal was to find something decent and similar, and federation was secondary at best for me; so I’ll see if it gets any worse, but for the moment, the first list definitely overweighs the second “list” for me.
Bluesky’s main feed is totally algorithm free, it’s just the people you follow’s posts in chronological order, same as mastodon.
Starter kits are optional, but they allow you to get started in hours rather than months. For me, they made the difference between a vibrant and interesting feed well tailored towards my interests, and a very sparse feed that I didn’t use on Mastodon. For me they were the difference between a useful social network and a non-useful one.
Main one is that it doesn’t manipulate your feed with stuff “you might enjoy” so you can’t be easily manipulated by the people setting the algorithm. Of course, this is exactly why people find it hard. People want to be fed stuff and told what to consume.
Bluesky also has the option of doing this, or not.
Do you refer to the “Following” Vs “Discover” feed?
Apparently it’s very noticeable when a post hits the discover feed. The quality of responses dives off a cliff.
There’s a new option available now for reply controls, you can limit it to just people who follow you. While it’s a very low bar, it’s enough of a threshold for most randoms to not bother following just to reply to you
And even without that, I still have felt that the quality of replies doesn’t drop THAT much one it hits Discover - but it may be partly who I follow/am recommended, that block lists are doing a great job of eliminating trolls+spam, and I just automatically ignore any stupid/low effort stuff (“wow you are the best at that thing you posted about”, “that js amazjng i have never seen a linux before” or whatever).
This option will only help, though.
This one is so important. After a year my mastodon feed is perfectly tailored for me. When I open it I enjoy my time there and the posts I see. I can leave whenever I want, and without a feel of rage or anxiety. But the most important part is that I don’t feel the compulsive need to open it every other second. It’s to liberating in contrast with the algorithm led manipulation.
That’s not really a fair description of what’s going on.
There is absolutely nothing wrong with a recommendation algorithm, can you imagine trying to use Netflix if it didn’t tell you about any of the shows and you just have to guess and type in a film in order to see if it existed?
The problem with algorithms is when they’re the only option, or when they are invisible and you think you are getting a timeline of people you’ve subscribed to, but really you’re getting an algorithm optimizing retention. As long as it’s just recommending stuff there’s nothing wrong with it, in fact as a lot of people point out, it’s kind of necessary.
The world functioned before recommendation algorithms. Even the internet did. Once upon a time, when Goggle worked, it didn’t modify its results based on your history.
Netflix could operate fine with classifications, ratings good tagging and search. It doesn’t need to monitor your viewing habits and recommend something based on them.
Yes but it would be more irritating to use than without which is my point.
The world function perfectly well without electricity but I don’t think anyone is seriously suggesting that we go back to a pre-electrified age just because technically it’s possible.
I’ve seen a few larger creators say the reply management is bad at scale, too. The thing I mostly like is that here I am, reading Lemmy from Mastodon.
Yeah I’d prefer Mastodon to implement all these features and win, but I understand why it’s not winning ATM.
Same. Plus I came back here because Bluesky got too noisy so I’m kind of happy if it stays small!
Lemmy is still my favorite, I was never a huge fan of the Twitter model, but I enjoy taking part in the destruction of X.
over time I’ll probably end up moving over to Lemmy tbh. I think I’d prefer more of a forum vibe. I was never a Redditor so I didn’t “get” it until I started following Lemmy feeds.
Cause the name is hard to remember… I was trying to yesterday and the closest I could get is megatron and megalodon
The name should have been MinBB (Mastadon is not Blue Bird).
It’s a big elephant and you send “Toots!”.
How do you confused that with a cynical robot and a giant shark? You’d post “Quips!” or “Bites!”. Wouldn’t work at all. 🙄
“Bites” is so cool…
I tried masterdon, mostertant (I don’t know what that one is) and eventually needed to look up the name from an E-Mail…
In a word, audience. I’d prefer it if everyone went with Mastodon, but the audience on BlueSky is orders of magnitude bigger. I cross post to both, but only because I don’t trust BlueSky not to do exactly what Twitter and Meta have done eventually.
They might do the Twitter. Jack Dorsey has already left the board saying exactly that.
I think there’s a fairly serious problem for large accounts on mastodon but I will never have one so I can’t quite understand it myself.
Something like dealing with replies / scolds without spending all day blocking is too hard. It doesn’t help that “no algorithm” means “show first reply at the top” so quick replies can dominate comments.
The bit I don’t understand is why this is fine on blue sky. Is it just different users? I can’t quite believe that but I can’t see why blue sky would be less annoying.
It’s not that it’s less annoying, it’s that it was in the right place at the right time to capture sufficient network effect…
There’s plenty of people on masto saying they have accounts on both but prefer bsky due to difficulty managing replies.
As I say I don’t really understand it but it’s a real thing big accounts experience.
Guess why? /s For real, people, some of you live in a bubble…
These who waited until the X take over to move away are simply following trends.
Why switch to Mastodon when there is Misskey?
Why use Misskey when there is Hubzilla?
I’ve yet to find a multi language or English speaking misskey it appears they’re all Japanese
You could spin one up this evening if you wanted. Or go use catodon.social.
That’s not the point. The point is, there are reasons Mastodon is being rejected, just like there are reasons you seemingly cannot pay people to use a Misskey-based or Hubzilla-based website.
It’s not where the people are going, and the public or semi-public figures are going to follow the people.
Gotta try the Misskey forks for English