There is no rule of law, then what are we doing here? Why are we playing ball?
Ok, MAGA wants to burn it down. Good for MAGA, they still don’t get to decide for everyone.
I won’t be able to do this for long. Why aren’t we in the streets? What’s so great about your life that authoritarian rule is not a threat to you?
Because the IRS doesn’t come for the wealthy who cheat. They come for the typical who cheat. And you know the IRS under Trump is gonna squeeze the lower classes like a beast.
Weird definition of the word cheat
Honestly - set your paycheck withholding to zero, hope others do the same to defund the government… and when tax day comes next year double check if the IRS still exists before submitting your payment.
100% doing this.
I’ll be an old man telling 16 year olds to withold 0 and create a savings account for tax day sounding like a depression era grandma telling you to reuse the trash bags.
Just so you know, you will likely face underpayment penalties doing this.
I suggest you avoid giving 16 year olds tax advice.
No you won’t.
Yeah I will
This is bad advice. The annual income you report on your taxes indicates how much you should have been setting aside throughout the year. Failing to do so can result in fines. There are exceptions for when your income increases part way through a year, but if you do what you describe, they WILL ding you for that.
You misunderstand how tax withholding works. When you sign up for tax withholding, the IRS gets a portion of your wage each paycheck and sets it aside for you to cover your tax bill the following year. The IRS is only holding that money for you during that time before your annual bill is due, in what amounts to you loaning the government money interest-free. Many people do not withhold taxes and just pay it all at once. And yes, at this point, whether the IRS will exist as a functioning entity in 2026 is a legitimate question, so not giving them a free loan might be a good idea
You don’t pay all at once, you need to pay quarterly tax estimates or you will be constantly paying penalties.
I really wish people would stop giving bad tax advice to strangers.
https://www.irs.gov/payments/underpayment-of-estimated-tax-by-individuals-penalty
You can underwithold income and payroll taxes through the year. There is no need to have periodic withholding it is just a convenience for budgeting.
The thing you cannot do if you don’t declare standard withholding is fall short or pay late (without a qualified extension). If you’re unable to pay the taxes you declined to pay through the year they will go after you. And if you’re late paying you will pay pretty significant interest on your owed amount.
Most employers don’t give you that option.
If you’re an employee, you should have filled out a W4 when you started your job to indicate your tax withholding. You are able to submit a new W4 at any time
If you refuse to pay and convince enough other people to refuse to pay, then well congrats. You just started a revolution.
Why aren’t we in the streets?
As someone watching from outside, I seriously have no idea.
Because we have no community because we’re worked like slaves, and nobody can save in this economy.
So anyone who stops working has a few months before becoming homeless, and will have no support system
It’s no coincidence that employers have started demanding everyone work from an office lately. If you’re commuting back and forth and everything with it you’ll have a lot less time and energy to fight back.
Also culture war bullshit to keep people distracted and divided.
And it was designed that way.
why aren’t we in the streets?
looks out window to street covered in protestors
But the reason not everyone is because mainly the middle and upper middle classes are still content enough, even if they hate trump. I don’t like him, but my living conditions are still very good. It’s a status quo I’m fine with
Those conditions are becoming less and less. Sure you might sleep well tonight but the second your maimed driving your polution machine you’re a burden on a system that no longer cares.
Say you make it to old age. A few more raids on the stock market and your 401k disappears and when you go to cash your social security it’s been drained since 2025.
Your future was just stolen from you and you don’t even know it yet.
No worries you raised a family, surely they will care for you. Except there is so much generational resentment they want nothing to do with you. Say you were good to them and they love you. Even then your fucked because elon took college grants and blew up the department of education. Now they are scrapping by because you didn’t have the money to bank roll them through private school and college.
Your twilight years which were suppose to be spent playing every game in your steam library while hooked up to an oculus rift have been replaced with waiting at Costco in the bread line and giving blowies so you can buy 30 minutes at the local PC bang to play overwatch 3.
Calm down and take your meds. Stonks always go up
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You are free to do whatever you want to do, however, there are consequences to your actions. If you believe that the US government will collapse and there will be no one to start garnishing your wages when you don’t report your taxes, then by all means, stop paying them.
Your reaction is “reactionary”, though. You come across as though you are looking for a reason to not pay taxes, and you think you’ve found one. Instead, you should be looking for ways to correct the problems you see. If you don’t like Musk, then find ways to undermine him. Refusal to pay your taxes isn’t it, though.
There is a whole government infrastructure in place to prevent musk which he has usurped. Why is it on me, and me alone?
You are giving false equivalency arguments. You are equating Musk’s abilities to some direct link in your taxes, as though the 25% you pay each paycheck is funding him. It isn’t. It is still funding garbage collection, national parks, welfare programs, and other critical infrastructure. Your taxes haven’t started going to new places. They are doing the exact same thing they have always done. You are being reactionary, and it comes off like you are either 15 years old and just learning about taxation, or 55 and learning about Libertarianism. Get a grip on yourself, realise that there is still work to be done, and being an infant about this shit isn’t doing anything but wasting people’s fucking time. If you don’t want to pay taxes, don’t. But don’t lie and say it’s about Musk. It’s selfishness. It’s because you can’t manage what money you have, and you think that little bit extra is going to make a difference. It won’t, though. You’ll still be broke because you spent all your money on weed and black light posters.
I was with you but if you’re calling out logical fallacies your ad homenims are a little much against the guy, who I agree, sounds 15 or a 55 sovcit.
The majority of your post is valid though, outside of the personal attacks.
You do realize you can still withhold federal, but not state taxes?
And I’m also aware of how much it will completely fuck you over if you do it.
You are not alone. You have the ability to make positive change. If you would wish to have a larger impact, organize, find strength with those in your community and it will grow.
You’re definitely not the only person proposing your course of action. By the way, it would be silly for me to refrain from filing taxes since I’m likely to get a small refund. From your own reasoning, why would I want the government to keep my money even longer interest free? In that case, I absolutely should file my taxes to take the money away from them.
ETA: As far as paying taxes in your paycheck, just talk to your employer and change your W-4 to the lowest payout. Your employer is required to withhold some of it for taxes, so talk to your employer if you want to pay absolutely zero on payday (and they will likely say no). Obviously that all varies depending on your employment arrangement, but it generally holds up.
Because of everyone does the thing with all the might necessary to do it themselves, then together they will do the biggest thing that’s ever been done.
If you believe that the US government will collapse and there will be no one to start garnishing your wages when you don’t report your taxes, then by all means, stop paying them.
Of course if that happens your dollars won’t be worth anything anyway.
Aren’t you glad you held onto them?
Legit point.
Does it matter who has the monopoly on violence, if you don’t? Ultimately, you pay taxes because if you refuse to for long enough, burly men with guns will eventually take your stuff and lock you up.
Why aren’t burly men coming for musk? How can my neighbor sit by and let it happen to me when they see nothing happen to him? The man illegally sticking their hand in their pocket.
Because he’s paid for them.
With who’s money?
Does it matter?
It should matter, if it’s your money.
Should and does are unfortunately not the same thing.
Platitudes
Why aren’t burly men coming for musk?
He has the support of the people with a monopoly on violence.
How can my neighbor sit by and let it happen to me
The fact that your neighbor can’t do anything is what makes it a monopoly.
The reason I would do it is not for monetary gain. I don’t believe I’m talking with someone who understands what the implications are of having musk in control all of the US’s appropriated funds.
Because not paying your taxes will draw attention from what remains of the system. I’m not thrilled about paying taxes to the dead and looted corpse of our government, but it’s better to stay under the radar.
Stay under the radar for what? Praying I’m not next? So I can continue an unfulfilled life as a wage slave and blink out of existence having learned or felt nothing of importance?
For being a low-key menace. https://www.cia.gov/static/5c875f3ec660e092cf893f60b4a288df/SimpleSabotage.pdf
Menance away
Because you’ll get bonked
We are all getting bonked. Our future is being robbed right out from under us.
Yes, but also always has been. Times have been bad before and it wasn’t ideal a few years ago either. Keep your head low and push in the right direction, like many good people have done before us.
Your vote for the status quo has been registered, but please note the status quo has been a decade-long continuous slide into fascism, so that is what you will be cosigning by keeping your head down.
blablabla I meant push for good change however you like. Most people aren’t able to throw molotovs.
Push for good change like calling your congress person and complaining? Campaigning for a progressive candidate in the mid-terms?
If you’re going to pretend for youself like it’s 2016, then just spare us. Your silence would be better than lumping all direct action into throwing molotovs.
When you dismiss the option set rather than productively try to add to the option set, any rational person would rightfully question your actual intentions.
I can’t call my congress person, I don’t live in the US
Then maybe don’t tell someone who does live here to keep their head down. Especially if you’re from where I think you’re from. You should be exhorting us to learn from your history and to not let this overtake us - because the fascists will have learned from your history as well.
I have money and I’m not comfortable in prison. That’s why.
They can’t put 350 million people in prison. What good is your money in a country of lawlessness? When you pay the thugs to not rob you, what will be left for yourself?
When you get all 350 million people to riot I’ll be on your side. But laying low is a more likely to succeed option. This country has never been fair or politically good. I prepared for this, because I could see it coming.
I literally pay taxes, that’s paying the thugs not to rob you. It works well in Japan too, their thugs will defend your shop.
I’m not mad at you. I could sit this one out just the as much as the next guy. The fact is injustice is happening right in front of you and if no one stops it, it will find it’s way to you.
Are you not a W2 slave?
I can chose my withholding
i think that will only work for this year, you will get penalties and they will withhold next year
Nah you’ll just have a big tax bill you have to save for
Yes but what about under payments?
Just throw away all your money and live like half the rest of us, broke. If you have no money, you have nothing to tax.
I am broke, no doubt, but they take the money from checks.
You get a check? Like, those paper payments?
I haven’t found one bank or establishment that’ll cash any of my former employer’s checks in over a decade. They tell me the companies I worked for aren’t registered as trusted employers/check issuers.
My past employers all had to cash their own damn checks and hand me cash money. And that’s largely why I quit repairing computers, tablets and phones back in 2017, apparently all the tech companies here are shady, to the point even their own banks don’t trust them.
Wish I knew what it was like to have an honest employer…
Edit: I was even denied direct deposit from my own bank. Why? Shit, even the bank manager didn’t know. So I closed my bank account and have been on paper cash money for about a decade. I have no reason to trust banks that won’t even let money be deposited into my account.
=/ not like a paper check, no. You ok, bro?
Read my edited comment.
No, I’m not exactly okay, my old bank and past employers all fucked me on getting paid.
Well musk is circling the wagons about to fuck us all, so I guess we have that in common.
Very sad timeline we live in…
