- cross-posted to:
- leftymemes@lemmy.dbzer0.com
- workreform@lemmy.world
- cross-posted to:
- leftymemes@lemmy.dbzer0.com
- workreform@lemmy.world
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To be clear, if you’re at all concerned about maintaining a food budget, even if it’s $500/week the billionaire class is still your enemy.
To be clear, the billionaire class is your enemy
To be clear, the 100 million class is also your enemy
I am always amazed how everyone is so focused on billionaires only
It’s just a class that is absolutely exploring people. You can’t become a billionaire without it. You can absolutely become an honest millionaire so it wouldn’t make sense to use that.
Yeah like there are folks who are worth 10ish million who just bought a house 50ish years ago that gained a lot of value and had dual incomes that saved all their money for retirement.
100 million folks are on THIN ice, but there is probably an author or inventor out there who made something really nice and everyone they worked with was also well taken care of. Most of them are probably garbage, but not all of them have to be. Some famous actors also were well known for making sure everyone got paid what they deserved on set and were very generous.
I just don’t see getting to a billion without someone being taken advantage of on the way though.
probably an author or inventor out there who made something really nice and everyone they worked with was also well taken care of.
JK Rowling should be a billionaire, but she keeps giving money away.
Yeah but she’s a garbage human being.
I just don’t see getting to a billion without someone being taken advantage of on the way though.
By all means, show me some billionaires that never took advantage of anyone to get their billions and actually earned it. I’m down to change my view.
You really pulled the extendo grip out, huh?
Lack of understanding of class. Billionaires are just the obscene top of the top of the bourgeoisie and they do excercise disproportional power in the ruling class, but the class war isn’t only about them, it’s about the system which makes their power possible. For example China also have billionaires, but they aren’t even 1/100 of a problem there.
Pareto principle. Eat the billionaires, distribute their wealth: 20% of the effort for 80% of the result.
Easier to focus on a few, very public individuals.
Any billionaire can lose 90% of their wealth and have above 100 million left.
Many can lose 99% and have above 100 million left.
Some can lose 99% and still be billionaires.
The 100 millionaire will still have a million or more left after losing 99%, but that’s not “live like hogs in the fat house forever” money at least. It’s just “I don’t have to worry if I lose my job” money.
A hundredbillionaire can lose 99% of their money and not make any perceptible changes in their lifestyle.
I propose the following:
Gap individual wealth at 50000x the national median annual income. Max wealth anyone in the US could have is, at present, under 2 billion. Other countries will vary, but generally it’s plenty enough to motivate people to innovate, but nobody gets to be Bezos or Musk wealthy. Yachts should count towards this wealth gap, at a depreciation rate of 5% a year off the build cost. Primary residence doesn’t count unless it’s also used for generating income. You get to have one car, regardless of price, that doesn’t get counted towards it, and the other ones count at market value. So you can have your classic car that appreciates in price, and a daily driver - without having to worry about the classic car’s effect on your wealth limit.
Side effect is that now suddenly rich people near the gap will be a lot more interested in paying better wages to the working class. Why? Because then they’d get to keep more of their money. And to raise the median efficiently, you need to be raising wages for the poorest among us first and foremost.
In general; I think even 2 billion is too much. Nobody needs that much money.
At best; I think no one should be able to have more than about 500 Million. You get one house, and one car for each adult family member if you’re married with non-adult kids. Adult kids don’t add uncounted vehicles; they have their own limit. Anything that is seaworthy or airworthy counts as about as much “Wealth” as you initially spent on it minus a reasonable depreciation rate yearly as determined by the market, so no buying a thing and having it lose 30% of it’s value the moment you drive it off the lot after buying it.
Additionally; to block too many shenanigans; wealth added by any property that is bought sticks; 3 years at minimum. This prevents people from storing too much excess in property and shell-gaming it. A company you own or have stake in cannot lend (in a long term) or gift you property in excess of 1% to 10% the wealth limit. (Depending on what the thing is). Companies may also not hold property or money in lieu of an individual personally; everything the company owns must have a global company function; and not personally benefit one or more people only. (Basically no executive-only or owner-only Jets; everyone from the tiniest manager on up should have access to it if there’s a business reason for it)
Oh I agree that even 2 billion is too much, but my reasoning is that proponents of capitalism often make the claim that capitalism drives innovation (you try to fill some market niche in order to get rich) so if they are right, then 2 billion should be enough that this still works.
I had yachts depreciating to zero in my example because it’s estimated that you have to spend about 10% of its’ purchase price annually anyway, so anyone keeping a 20 year old yacht around is going to be spending a lot of money on it that will fuel other parts of the economy.
Holy cow, they can lose 90% of their wealth and still be above 100 mil. The math checks out, but my gosh, how rich are they?!
It’s ridiculous.
Numbers are funny, anyway. Nvidia CEO Jensen Huang’s net worth is closer to yours and mine than it is to Elon Musk (Forbes list currently placing them at ~100 bill and ~250 bill respectively). But that’s only in absolute terms. In reality, Jensen’s got like 8 or 9 orders of magnitude more wealth than I do depending on how far into the month we are, and on the same order of magnitude as Musk.
Either one losing 99% of their wealth would still be above a billion.
Well, at least now I feel that Musks tweet about liberty and being oppressed and blah are even more funny than ever. He has literally the wealth to buy countries, if he would wish to.
with 100mils you can buy two luxurious houses and still have enough money to spend a million each year which is more money than most people make in their entire life, so yea kind of on the border.
Hey, there might be some politicians on here who can always call up their good friends whenever they need something!
To be positively translucent, even someone with $1,000,000 in the bank has 1000x less than the poorest billionaire. For other disturbing facts, see https://mkorostoff.github.io/1-pixel-wealth/.
For everyone following along at home: this website is worth a click if you’ve never seen it before!
Represented as a volume is also great. If I’m not wrong, his wealth in 500€ bills is a 165 m (180 yards) cube. One million is 3 l (a little less than 0.8 gallons).
Which of course is a stupid comparison indicative of economic ignorance, because wealth does not grow linearly for anyone who doesn’t stuff their money under a mattress.
I want $500/week for food!
Hell, even if you can easily afford way more than that, you are still closer to the person who can only afford $2 of food a day than a billionaire.
The difference between a million and a billion is about a billion
Ain’t that the truth! I’m a lay off and a medical emergency from needing to do this diet.
Billionaires are either an apocalypse or a revolution away from needing to do this.
One of these is much more likely to happen tomorrow than the other.
Ok but for real tho. The average American severely underestimates how far you can get on rice, beans, lentils and chickpeas.
Serious question, if I live off just that, I end up feeling like absolute garbage. That’s even with supplementing it with greens like spinach and some other veggies and vitamin supplements. What am I missing?
Like, macro-wise, I can replace meat and other things, but it doesn’t seem to hit the same?
Get a blood test. You could have a micronutrient deficiency. It is common to develop either vitamin D, B or iron deficiencies when you cut meat since they just aren’t as abundant outside of red meat and organ meat.
Would you care to elaborate on what you feel like when you try living on plants? What do you tend to eat? How long does it take before you start feeling like shit?
Judging by your last comment about it “not hitting the same” my initial thought is that the issue might not even be nutritional, possibly more psychological/subjective.
I end up feeling like absolute garbage.
Maybe, not cooking it well enough? Try changing your recipes, perhaps? Maybe more variety in spices?
Gram, pulses and dried beans (rehydrated before eating) with rice, tend to make my favourite recipes
and even though I use milk products, I feel pretty good even if it is lemonade with black-salt instead.Oh, it tastes fine, I’m saying like…energy-wise and sugar-crash-wise I feel bad. Just wondering if I’m missing something.
Fruit?
You probably need a fattier diet for your nutrition needs, since the diet listed is a carbs-and-protein diet. Try having way more nut butters / olive oil / other healthy fats
I’ve started eating a fruit (usually apple) after breakfast, and sometimes as an afternoon snack, and that keeps my energy up, personally.
If this is a new regimen for you it might just be an adjustment period. But I’m not a nutritionist. Just some random bean fan.
sugar-crash-wise
I meant the same thing. Spices are more than just taste.
And I seldom put sugar in my lemonade.
The rice seems to do the job
Don’t know what you’re missing because we don’t know everything you eat
Spinach gives iron so based off the information it’s not that
Maybe a shot of insulin, from the sounds of it.
Every plant is trying to kill you. It doesn’t want to be eaten. It especially doesn’t want you to eat its seeds. We can detoxify most of the ones that people eat, but it costs
Eating the same plants over again can make you sick
You may not be as good at detoxifying those plants as the people who do well eating them
I know I’m a lot healthier with no plants in my diet than I have been with lots of plants
If I could get us all to protest grocery store prices by eating nothing but staples whenever there is a random price increase I would die happy XD
Rice amd beans is the most important thing on my region’s diet. You just can’t live without eating it at least once.
YOU ARE A FOOL AND THE REBELLION DEMANDS YOU EAT LAGUMES!
Capitalism demands you eat legumes or go into debt.
The rebellion demands you stay alive how you need to and organize, which in the US means eating cheap proteins as you gotta.
Feel free to ask me questions on how to eat on a budget so you can keep your strength up while organizing against those that wish nothing more for you to work until the day you die and own nothing of consequence!
Man where were you 8 years ago when I ate zero protein because I didn’t know it could be cheap. Couldn’t afford animal products and was conditioned to believe those were the only viable source of protein.
Btw I’d like to add textured vegetable protein to the list! It’s one of my go-tos nowadays.
Out of interest, what do you mean with textured vegetable protein?
Soy flour turned into little chunks to give feeling of chunks in things you’re used to having meat chunks in while being high in protein. So like burritos, stews, pasta sauce, stuff like that.
I had to look it up myself.
Textured or texturized vegetable protein (TVP), also known as textured soy protein (TSP), soy meat, or soya chunks, is a defatted soy flour product, a by-product of extracting soybean oil. It is often used as a meat analogue or meat extender. It is quick to cook, with a protein content comparable to some meats.
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I grew up a similar way! My mom always referred to protein as meat. Needed to add chicken or beef or pork to be the “protein” to make a dinner complete.
Never mind it being cheese or bean based, meaning it had tons of protein.
I would have to do the math on TVP on if it’s a better source of protein per buck than like split peas. But glad it’s working out for you!
Where I live it is, because of local-ish soy production. Also helps that it’s a complete protein, so you don’t have to think as much about which amino acids you’re getting from where.
Another great one is seitan aka wheat meat, and it’s really cheap if you make it from flour rather than vital wheat gluten. Still pretty cheap if made from vital wheat gluten too.
I like your mission, but I hate your methods. Think more about what you’re suggesting.
You’ll have to clarify what is wrong with my methods.
What about eating people’s cats and allegedly ducks as well? Did you know thousands of pets are euthanized each year? That’s all just wasted food.
two conspiracy theories in one! i love that community.
The “red necks” who do road kill specials are just fighting against ground beef being $5/pound (which is somehow after all the subsidies they get in the US)!
I feel like some red neck making fun of is straight up just making fun of folks who found a way to make do and be happy. Like owning your own land with a little pre fab you learned to maintain yourself, and eating lots of hunted game? Good stuff.
Jesus Christ, you’re actually fucking nuts.
This is ML memes. If you came in here expecting us not to be over the top about “seize the means of production” and “eat the rich” then you gotta pay more attention.
Sometimes I wonder if I’m far enough to the left to participate in ML.
This man asking the real questions. As a non-conservative, I try to eat cats and dogs three times a week, and keep lagumes and oats to the other days.
I never touch animal protein, as the fascists plant tracking devices in these creatures! Birds are also a concern, as they aren’t real and are really government survailance devices!
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“Also, do you really NEED to sleep?”
I have a union and still just scraping by. But if I didn’t have the union I’d have drowned by now
Plant based whole foods, the fuel of the rebellion!
I wish I could eat like this - not only for the cost effectiveness, but it’d be better for the environment than meat! Having IBD really sucks. I can only imagine how difficult it is in the US where the medical care is so expensive on top of everything else.
What’s the difference between a chick pea and a garbanzo bean?
spoiler
I’ve never paid to have a garbanzo bean on my face
That duck is looking pretty tasty right about now.
Hey if you have a legal place to hunt, go wild!
Buying anything but the cheapest of meats these days is eye watering. I’m not one for hunting, but I keep debating going foraging since I live near mountains in Utah. Spend the day hiking in nice weather and end the day with food you normally wouldn’t have? Sounds like a good day.
Unionization isn’t enough, we need syndicalism. They’re like Unions but armed, more organized, more willing to strike and sabotage, and unlike Unions which attempt to hold back the Capitalists Syndicates replace capitalism entirely. Remember, why demand the scraps of the capitalists when we can take the means of production and the complete value of our labor.
Pro life tip: Read theory, join your local socialist or anarchist organization, get involved, strike, sabotage, just make sure to organize
“Hey won’t this get us banned… oh right, ML!”
If they bring armed thugs to the strikes, only fair if strikers do as well. Negotiation only happens between parties on equal footing.
Every striker should be armed, the workers must have the power advantage over the capitalists
Syndicalism is nice, but without a solid analysis of Imperialism it risks taking on a Nationalist character if you’re in the Imperial Core. Additionally, if you’re in a de-industrialized nation like the United States, worker organization is more difficult along union lines, which is partially why Unions have historically struggled in the United States in recent years.
100% agree on reading theory and joining an org, just wanted to add some caveats.
Just posted this a bit ago:
“Sean Aloysius O’Brien… They fished his body out of the Allegheny river a week before the strike ended. Thirty two bullets he had in him. Or was it thirty four?” -Miles O’brien
Damn, do you think he worked for Boeing
I can buy oats and flour on the cheap around here, but chickpeas and dried beans? That’s very quickly sounding like $10 a day.
Bruh how? You can get kilograms of dried beans for $10.
It’s more expensive for canned beans but for $10 are you eating 5 cans of organic beans a day?
Maybe chickpeas are expensive where you live, or maybe you miscalculated. Either way, take a look at my numbers for comparison.
We can get a 3.63kg bag of chickpeas here for $7.49 (CAD). Assuming you fulfill all your Calorie and protein needs from chickpeas alone (2500 Calories and 150g protein per day), it comes out to about $600/year. That’s $1.64/day. In order to be $10/day, you’d have to pay 6x as much for your chickpeas, so that same 3.63kg bag would have to cost $45.50.
I live in Denmark.
Where are you buying dried beans?
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07BBVFBGW?tag=sacapuntas9-20&linkCode=osi&th=1&psc=1
These are 1.28 a pound, if you have a winco or costco you can get much cheaper.
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B09SHBKHTH?tag=sacapuntas9-20&linkCode=osi&th=1&psc=1
These are 2 dollars a pound.
So like you would turn this into hummus and eat it with bread/tortillas you made from flour.
There’s no Amazon in Denmark. Basically anything bought from Amazon either comes from Germany or the UK, which makes Amazon probably the worst, most expensive option for any reason.
Ahh interesting! In Denmark what is the cheap protein replacement? In the US it’s mostly all dried beans.
Well let me think…
I know a few local supermarkets sell frozen chickpeas in bags of 500 grams. And I think, off the top of my head, the price ranges between 15 dkk ($2.24) and 40 dkk ($5.97), depending on if there’s a sale on and which supermarket I go to. I know that Rema 1000 is on the cheaper end, and frozen vegetable products tend to go on sale pretty often, but it’s never the same products, so it’s very unpredictable when chickpeas go on sale. These prices include tax, as tax is not excluded from products in stores.
That means that 3 kg of frozen chickpeas would be between $14.44 (uaually when on sale) or $36.02.
Now, I can get dried beans and peas in much larger bulk from the various Arab stores in Copenhagen, but buying bags of dried goods from those stores comes with the risk of getting pantry moths. I’m still battling those little fuckers from the time I bought a large 5 kg bag of really high quality rice two years ago.
So when you want cheap protein, what is affordable in denmark? Cheeses? Lentils? Yogurt? Sounds like it’s a lot more where you live, so curious what is the good choice there.
Where potato
I feel like since they are mostly water weight, the math doesn’t always look great. But let’s go through it!
For example: https://www.walmart.com/ip/Russet-Potatoes-10-lb-Bag-Whole/10449951?classType=REGULAR&from=/search
10 pounds of food for $3 sounds great, but in a pound there is only 300 calories about, depending on type/peel/etc. So 3,000 calories for 3 dollars. At $1 per 1000 calories it isn’t bad.
But let’s compare to this 5 pound bag of flour for 2.38, at 3 cents an ounce:
https://www.walmart.com/search?q=flour
A pound of flour has 1,600 calories. So this bag of flour that is cheaper than the potatoes, has 8000 calories for 2.50. But you’ll need to put in some elbow grease to make it edible. Doing a sourdough is probably the cheapest way to do it since all you need is flour, water, salt, and the starter you made using flour, but it is more time intensive. So about 3,200 calories for a dollar.
Rice comes in with a very similar amount of calories, but just a little more expensive at 4 cents an ounce:
Rice is a bit easier to turn edible though, so the extra dollar might be worth it for a 5 pound bag. 2,400 calories per dollar spent.
Then oatmeal comes in as our most expensive at 7 cents an ounce.
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01KV4H51G?tag=sacapuntas9-20&linkCode=osi&th=1&psc=1
At once again 1600ish calories for a pound of dry oatmeal, it is 1.12 per pound. So it is creeping up closer to the price of potatoes TBH, and if you were super on a budget the oatmeal would be the first to go. But I suppose potatoes aren’t “that” much worse than oatmeal. But my thought was oatmeal is good breakfast option so wanted to include it, and the top bit is mostly setup for bottom.
Knowing this stuff is helpful to our daily lives because rich people hate us.
I think you need to include energy cost in the preparation stage. Bread requires a hot oven, which is a real amount of electricity — it’s close to $0.40/kWh where I live. From this link it says that a bread maker uses only .36kWh, but an electric oven would be more like 1.6kWh. So bakita single loaf of bread, you end up with a not insubstantial fraction of the total cost going to heating the oven.
Of course, many bulk foods require heat, so it gets a little sticky this way. Oats/oatmeal probably wins out here, as you can just soak them overnight.
Good point! Rice makers are super efficient, so rice made with that might be the winner. But honestly the cheap carbs you can stand and make edible cheaply are probably just what you gotta go with.
It takes less time to cook than bread, but most other proteins take a bit of time to cook as well.
energy costs could probably be significantly reduced if the cooking was done on an industrial scale, so that most of the head goes into the food
I’m sure all of this is correct, but you’re forgetting one thing: potatoes are the only one of these you can grow enough of to eat at home, as long as you have space for a bucket or sack or two of soil, and which basically require zero processing aside from applying heat to consume.
I agree with you that we shouldn’t actually need to know or use any of this information, and as a poor disabled person I also know that growing your own food isn’t always an option for everyone, but if it is an option, I think it at the very least puts potatoes back in the running.
You absolutely got me there! I mentioned making your own sour dough, but didn’t factor in growing potatoes.
You’re good, no “gotcha” intended, I just think potatoes are too good to overlook 😁
I’m thinking about this too much now. Maybe tortillas would be the best bet? Or at least cheaper than bread. Also tortillas go great with lots of different cooked beans and cheap as dirt spices.
When we’re talking about a penny per ounce in savings, math gets angry.
Could maybe pepper gravy over rice be the best bet?
