Biden tried to forgive half a trillion dollars in student debt, took the biggest action on climate change in history which is estimated to reduce emissions by 40% by 2030 if Trump doesn’t undo it, strengthened the NLRB which has been giving legal backing to a lot of these union wins, grew wages at the bottom end of the pay scale even in the face of historic inflation, and a few other things.
It is also relevant that he doesn’t want to end democracy in the Unites States, “finish the job” in Gaza, or fire on protestors with live ammunition, like Trump does. But if for some reason you’ve decided it’s not allowed to make the decision on those bases (and I don’t know why it wouldn’t), there are also good things to say about Biden.
Oh, I mean, my bad. Rail strike worst president ever both sides amirite
Biden rejoined the Paris Climate Agreement, revoked the Keystone Pipeline permit, created a 13 million acre federal petroleum reserve for Alaskan wildlife, greatly increased oil site lease cost, signed $7B in solar subsidies, enacted the Inflation Reduction act to support clean energy, created the CHIPS Act to improve reliance on domestic technology, reenacted Net Neutrality, repealed Title 42, ended the Muslim Ban, signed the Equality Act for LGBTQ+ rights, restored gay rights to beneficiaries, reenacted trans care anti-discrimination law, signed the Respect for Marriage Act, enabled unspecified gender on US Passports, rejoined WHO, rescheduled marijuana, reducing drug costs with the American Rescue Plan Act…
Edit: I misunderstood when I read the second half of your comment. For what it’s worth, I agree about Israel. It’s simply not a comparison since Trump has been clear about his intentions with Palestine and Ukraine.
Wait, I am confused. Are we arguing? I thought Biden was doing great up until Netanyahu started killing Gazans by the thousands. He’s been doing weird little half-hearted things like holding up the weapons shipments, but hauling Netanyahu to the ICC would have been a better idea.
But yes, in general, Biden’s a huge improvement over the norm in a bunch of ways that for some reason aren’t talked about real often, and Trump is the end of the world (for the Palestinians and other Arabs and Hispanics and a whole bunch of other minorities foreign and domestic, in addition to everyone else). I feel like we’re on the same page on that, and I didn’t realize when I read your first message.
My initial comment was intended to imply that there’s no “pro-Trump” argument, only “anti-Biden” arguments, so it read that way to me. I’m sorry if I misunderstood your intention through context. I’m pretty tired. I’ll edit for clarity.
Ha, all good. I got it backwards; I thought you were saying the opposite. But yeah, makes sense.
Maybe I am just excited to argue with some internet “leftists” who for some reason have their leftism mostly restricted to activism about not voting for Biden, and nothing else. There are a lot of them here in general, but maybe they are absent currently in this thread, because they’re afraid we will gang up on them
Agreed. It’s selfish and arrogant to know Trump will facilitate the killing of more innocent civilians and still abstain from voting on principle. Biden is literally the lesser of two evils in regards to Israel. Hopefully the UN and State Department find enough proof to give Biden a firm platform for withdrawal of support soon. It’ll save lives, and we won’t have to think about the despicable trolley car from now until November.
I was the one who had it backwards. Thanks for being understanding of my confusion.
It is also relevant that he doesn’t want to end democracy in the Unites States, “finish the job” in Gaza, or fire on protestors with live ammunition.
yet, he does. democracy is barely a thing in the US, israel is finishing the job on gaza with his money, and students were disproportionaly crushed by the police for daring to even complain.
i judge politicians by actions and not words.
Rail strike worst president ever both sides amirite
unironically this. he used police force to coopt what could have been the first actual worker win in decades for less than bare minimum rights. he prohibited them from striking. he did stop rich people from losing money from it.
He can’t. They were simply referring to Trump’s response to the peaceful protest of the killing of George Floyd. “Can’t you just shoot them, just shoot them in the legs or something?” It’s not within his power, although it does clearly illuminate his opinion of protesters.
If the President takes direct oversight of local law enforcement, we have much larger problems on our hands. That’s exactly how Benito Mussolini took fascist control of his nation.
For the same reason Trump can’t. I wrote “the President,” not Trump, for a reason. There’s a hierarchy in local and state law enforcement unlike the direct command of military or the National Guard. They are state-regulated bodies, not overseen nationally. The Director-General of Police reports to the Mayor, who in turn reports to the Governor.
If the National Guard shows up to regulate a protest, you can blame the President. Y’know, like Trump did to the protesters in DC and Portland.
I’m not OP, but Trump attempted more than once to have the National Guard shoot protesters with live ammunition.
There are enough guardrails in place that it didn’t work, but part of what I expect this time around would be the Florida State Guard and similar Neo-brownshirts coming into their own so that he would literally be able to do it.
Also, he had CBP showing up to protests and snatching people without identifying themselves or utilizing the existing jail / police / court infrastructure. It actually took a little time for people to even figure out who were these unidentified big quasi-police grabbing protestors and driving away with them, or where they had taken them.
Biden is, as far as I know, not personally involved in violence against protesters today. Trump was personally involved in violence against BLM protesters, and wanted to increase its severity to lethal force levels.
Yes. The President can direct the National Guard, not the state or local police that have been shutting down protests. Their oversight begins with the Mayor, and stops at the Governor. The President must formally declare a National Emergency to have police oversight. If you want to complain about the police, blame the Mayor. If the National Guard shuts down a protest, blame Biden.
I must be a collaborator. Democrats campaigned in 2020 to shut down camps at the border, reasonably support the conclusion of the pandemic, fund infrastructure and restore state/union support. When did “stop the fascist” become a political platform? Why are Democrats not complicit in mass murder?
biden stopped the railworkers strikes forcibly and gave them bare minimum, still bad protections. my third world country can still do better so far.
that strike had the potential to kick off the next workers rights movement and actually make you on par with the rest of the developed world.
biden coopted a mass movement and stopped rich people from losing money, and workers from actually getting something done for the first time in decades. using violent police force and painting himself as a saviour. all that with a pathetic 30-second speech over the picket line. stay away next time.
he can move billions of dollars all he wants but its meaningless when that money doesnt actually go to people, but sure im the one unable to read.
I’m not trying to downplay the hard work that unions have been putting in that have been getting them significant gains in the last few years. But Biden’s NLRB has been right there with them negotiating with the companies and giving them legal support which is absolutely crucial.
my third world country can still do better so far.
Wait – you’re not from the US, and deeply concerned with the US election and wanting to weigh in on who needs to win it?
I know when I have some spare time, I like to go involve myself in British elections, or Japanese; I talk on message boards to people from those countries and have all sorts of things to tell them about how they should vote. It’s just something I like to do.
so he basically coopted the movement with his own appointed people, with bipartisan support. the actual result of it is zero paid time off for sick workers, one of their main concern when striking. they are still working grueling hours, and have to be on call for even more grueling hours. IIRC biden even outlawed further strikes under threat of violence (!!!). the one good thing he did was increase their bad salaries for… slightly less bad salaries, no free time and no further right to demand anything else?
thats a lot of shifting money and people around so they can pretty much end the strike without caving to most of the worker’s demands, and keep the status quo. that is the main thing when leftists complain about elected “left” wing representatives being all talk while still keeping workers in a bad situation.
the threat to the shareholders’ pockets alone was enough to get them on their feet and respond immediatly, this could have been the birth of another worker’s rights movement, but it was a big nothingburger instead.
Unions in the US have the same leaders they always did. Now, though, they have an NLRB who will fight legal battles on their behalf. Here’s a general overview.
How on earth is that a bad thing? You’re saying the NLRB was “coopted” by the federal government? I’m having trouble even understanding what you’re saying happened, here.
i have all the reason to be concerned given your long history messing with our democracies in the region
Yeah, this part makes sense to me (and in particular as a reason to be suspicious of any US politician, Biden included). That said, given Trump’s unusual-even-compared-with-the-American-standard support for overt dictators the world over, including Bolsonaro, you should definitely want Trump not to win power again, right?
Now, though, they have an NLRB who will fight legal battles on their behalf.
as someone thats pretty far left, i understand that rich people rule a given country through the state and politicians and we have much less influence over it than they do.
-whether this works still remains to be seen but i’m skeptical. legal battles tend to be longer and are harder to be ruled in favour of the weaker link pretty much everywhere, i’m under the assumption politicians are very aware of this even if they play dumb, and we won’t be able to actually defend this system because iirc they outlawed further striking. we are relying solely on judges and politicians.
-on the other hand strikes, especially something like railroads which make the backbone of trade and production in any country, elicit a very quick response with very consequential decisions from our overlords. workers have the upper hand in the sense that even a week without them will hit the corporations very hard in their pockets. this is what they truly care about and respond to. breaking a strike up can be complicated after it reaches critical mass, hiring scabs is difficult, and workers get to tell a big fat NO to abusive conditions with chips in their hands they can play when negotiating, in addition to other protections that might exist.
massive, coordinated striking is a big part of leftist strategy because it skips politicians, rich people and governments entirely, it doesn’t matter who’s in power then. its a more direct way of doing democracy. this is why we say killing this mass movement in favour of bureaucracy is bad for us. at best it will slow us down and at worst it will be attacked or influenced by the next trump when the workers really need it. not that many don’t currently really need it, but the frog can always be boiled further.
you should definitely want Trump not to win power again, right?
well i also understand that even inside capitalism, when the state is pressured to be more democratic, the people tend to not want to fuck over other people inside and abroad to sustain the profit of a few.
we are usually treated with the same contempt by both republicans and democrats, i dont think the more open fascim republicans plan have will change anything for us until the international correlation of power changes. that and biden maintains the status quo which is already pretty bad, what is happening in gaza could very well be happening to us given the right circumstances, for example. this is why.
i don’t want trump to win because he will strain the system in the opposite direction i would want, but hes polling ahead and its looking like he will very much win regardless. strong unions are something that would 100% definetly push back but with bidens move to deflate the most important one at the time, i doubt it. this is pretty much ratchet theory or whatever its called nowadays.
I know many non-US people, especially from the global south, who take the attitude: Hey the US government is full of enemies to us, don’t try to tell me anything good about any one of them, please and thanks. For them to take that viewpoint honestly makes perfect sense to me.
I know absolutely 0 of them who go on message boards and get real involved in talking with Americans about how they should view American politics and who they should support in American elections or who they shouldn’t, and how to view it, and what those people did in domestic US politics decisions and why that should impact who I support in the election.
Just one of those little mysteries one encounters sometimes
When they can’t find anything good to say about their own party, attacking the opposition is the entirety of their argument.
Hi!
Biden tried to forgive half a trillion dollars in student debt, took the biggest action on climate change in history which is estimated to reduce emissions by 40% by 2030 if Trump doesn’t undo it, strengthened the NLRB which has been giving legal backing to a lot of these union wins, grew wages at the bottom end of the pay scale even in the face of historic inflation, and a few other things.
It is also relevant that he doesn’t want to end democracy in the Unites States, “finish the job” in Gaza, or fire on protestors with live ammunition, like Trump does. But if for some reason you’ve decided it’s not allowed to make the decision on those bases (and I don’t know why it wouldn’t), there are also good things to say about Biden.
Oh, I mean, my bad. Rail strike worst president ever both sides amirite
Biden rejoined the Paris Climate Agreement, revoked the Keystone Pipeline permit, created a 13 million acre federal petroleum reserve for Alaskan wildlife, greatly increased oil site lease cost, signed $7B in solar subsidies, enacted the Inflation Reduction act to support clean energy, created the CHIPS Act to improve reliance on domestic technology, reenacted Net Neutrality, repealed Title 42, ended the Muslim Ban, signed the Equality Act for LGBTQ+ rights, restored gay rights to beneficiaries, reenacted trans care anti-discrimination law, signed the Respect for Marriage Act, enabled unspecified gender on US Passports, rejoined WHO, rescheduled marijuana, reducing drug costs with the American Rescue Plan Act…
Edit: I misunderstood when I read the second half of your comment. For what it’s worth, I agree about Israel. It’s simply not a comparison since Trump has been clear about his intentions with Palestine and Ukraine.
Wait, I am confused. Are we arguing? I thought Biden was doing great up until Netanyahu started killing Gazans by the thousands. He’s been doing weird little half-hearted things like holding up the weapons shipments, but hauling Netanyahu to the ICC would have been a better idea.
But yes, in general, Biden’s a huge improvement over the norm in a bunch of ways that for some reason aren’t talked about real often, and Trump is the end of the world (for the Palestinians and other Arabs and Hispanics and a whole bunch of other minorities foreign and domestic, in addition to everyone else). I feel like we’re on the same page on that, and I didn’t realize when I read your first message.
My initial comment was intended to imply that there’s no “pro-Trump” argument, only “anti-Biden” arguments, so it read that way to me. I’m sorry if I misunderstood your intention through context. I’m pretty tired. I’ll edit for clarity.
Ha, all good. I got it backwards; I thought you were saying the opposite. But yeah, makes sense.
Maybe I am just excited to argue with some internet “leftists” who for some reason have their leftism mostly restricted to activism about not voting for Biden, and nothing else. There are a lot of them here in general, but maybe they are absent currently in this thread, because they’re afraid we will gang up on them
Agreed. It’s selfish and arrogant to know Trump will facilitate the killing of more innocent civilians and still abstain from voting on principle. Biden is literally the lesser of two evils in regards to Israel. Hopefully the UN and State Department find enough proof to give Biden a firm platform for withdrawal of support soon. It’ll save lives, and we won’t have to think about the despicable trolley car from now until November.
I was the one who had it backwards. Thanks for being understanding of my confusion.
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yet, he does. democracy is barely a thing in the US, israel is finishing the job on gaza with his money, and students were disproportionaly crushed by the police for daring to even complain.
i judge politicians by actions and not words.
unironically this. he used police force to coopt what could have been the first actual worker win in decades for less than bare minimum rights. he prohibited them from striking. he did stop rich people from losing money from it.
I didn’t realize that the police departments reported directly to the President. Do you have a source on that?
how will trump shoot the protesters like op is saying he will then?
He can’t. They were simply referring to Trump’s response to the peaceful protest of the killing of George Floyd. “Can’t you just shoot them, just shoot them in the legs or something?” It’s not within his power, although it does clearly illuminate his opinion of protesters.
If the President takes direct oversight of local law enforcement, we have much larger problems on our hands. That’s exactly how Benito Mussolini took fascist control of his nation.
https://www.history.com/news/mussolini-italy-fascism#
why cant biden do this then?
For the same reason Trump can’t. I wrote “the President,” not Trump, for a reason. There’s a hierarchy in local and state law enforcement unlike the direct command of military or the National Guard. They are state-regulated bodies, not overseen nationally. The Director-General of Police reports to the Mayor, who in turn reports to the Governor.
If the National Guard shows up to regulate a protest, you can blame the President. Y’know, like Trump did to the protesters in DC and Portland.
https://www.nbcnews.com/think/opinion/trump-barr-used-loophole-deploy-national-guard-u-s-cities-ncna1236034
I’m not OP, but Trump attempted more than once to have the National Guard shoot protesters with live ammunition.
There are enough guardrails in place that it didn’t work, but part of what I expect this time around would be the Florida State Guard and similar Neo-brownshirts coming into their own so that he would literally be able to do it.
Also, he had CBP showing up to protests and snatching people without identifying themselves or utilizing the existing jail / police / court infrastructure. It actually took a little time for people to even figure out who were these unidentified big quasi-police grabbing protestors and driving away with them, or where they had taken them.
Biden is, as far as I know, not personally involved in violence against protesters today. Trump was personally involved in violence against BLM protesters, and wanted to increase its severity to lethal force levels.
Yes. The President can direct the National Guard, not the state or local police that have been shutting down protests. Their oversight begins with the Mayor, and stops at the Governor. The President must formally declare a National Emergency to have police oversight. If you want to complain about the police, blame the Mayor. If the National Guard shuts down a protest, blame Biden.
so he won’t?
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If you need any more convincing than “stop the fascists”, you’re a collaborator.
I must be a collaborator. Democrats campaigned in 2020 to shut down camps at the border, reasonably support the conclusion of the pandemic, fund infrastructure and restore state/union support. When did “stop the fascist” become a political platform? Why are Democrats not complicit in mass murder?
Well, they did a lot of that.
Biden got the railworkers the things they wanted in the strike without a strike.
Biden has cleared billions of dollars for rail support.
He was also the first president in the history of the United States to walk a picket line.
As far as the camps are concerned, it would require congress to end them as the camps are powered by a law that was passed underneath GWB.
Its not bidens fault some of you are unable to read.
biden stopped the railworkers strikes forcibly and gave them bare minimum, still bad protections. my third world country can still do better so far.
that strike had the potential to kick off the next workers rights movement and actually make you on par with the rest of the developed world.
biden coopted a mass movement and stopped rich people from losing money, and workers from actually getting something done for the first time in decades. using violent police force and painting himself as a saviour. all that with a pathetic 30-second speech over the picket line. stay away next time.
he can move billions of dollars all he wants but its meaningless when that money doesnt actually go to people, but sure im the one unable to read.
Biden fired the guy who used to run the NLRB, and put in a bunch of actually pro-labor people, who gave lots of material support to all this union activity that coincidentally has been meeting with all sorts of success over the last couple of years.
I’m not trying to downplay the hard work that unions have been putting in that have been getting them significant gains in the last few years. But Biden’s NLRB has been right there with them negotiating with the companies and giving them legal support which is absolutely crucial.
Wait – you’re not from the US, and deeply concerned with the US election and wanting to weigh in on who needs to win it?
I know when I have some spare time, I like to go involve myself in British elections, or Japanese; I talk on message boards to people from those countries and have all sorts of things to tell them about how they should vote. It’s just something I like to do.
so he basically coopted the movement with his own appointed people, with bipartisan support. the actual result of it is zero paid time off for sick workers, one of their main concern when striking. they are still working grueling hours, and have to be on call for even more grueling hours. IIRC biden even outlawed further strikes under threat of violence (!!!). the one good thing he did was increase their bad salaries for… slightly less bad salaries, no free time and no further right to demand anything else?
thats a lot of shifting money and people around so they can pretty much end the strike without caving to most of the worker’s demands, and keep the status quo. that is the main thing when leftists complain about elected “left” wing representatives being all talk while still keeping workers in a bad situation.
the threat to the shareholders’ pockets alone was enough to get them on their feet and respond immediatly, this could have been the birth of another worker’s rights movement, but it was a big nothingburger instead.
about the ad hominem, let me give you the tip of the iceberg: our conservative politicians literally went to the us recently, to basically ask your politicians for brutal sanctions on our country, the same people who tried to copycat trump’s jan 6 so yeah, i have all the reason to be concerned given your long history messing with our democracies in the region. thanks for the condescention though, but i bet a lot of you have many concerns about ukranian and russian politics now.
Absolutely false.
Unions in the US have the same leaders they always did. Now, though, they have an NLRB who will fight legal battles on their behalf. Here’s a general overview.
How on earth is that a bad thing? You’re saying the NLRB was “coopted” by the federal government? I’m having trouble even understanding what you’re saying happened, here.
Yeah, this part makes sense to me (and in particular as a reason to be suspicious of any US politician, Biden included). That said, given Trump’s unusual-even-compared-with-the-American-standard support for overt dictators the world over, including Bolsonaro, you should definitely want Trump not to win power again, right?
as someone thats pretty far left, i understand that rich people rule a given country through the state and politicians and we have much less influence over it than they do.
-whether this works still remains to be seen but i’m skeptical. legal battles tend to be longer and are harder to be ruled in favour of the weaker link pretty much everywhere, i’m under the assumption politicians are very aware of this even if they play dumb, and we won’t be able to actually defend this system because iirc they outlawed further striking. we are relying solely on judges and politicians.
-on the other hand strikes, especially something like railroads which make the backbone of trade and production in any country, elicit a very quick response with very consequential decisions from our overlords. workers have the upper hand in the sense that even a week without them will hit the corporations very hard in their pockets. this is what they truly care about and respond to. breaking a strike up can be complicated after it reaches critical mass, hiring scabs is difficult, and workers get to tell a big fat NO to abusive conditions with chips in their hands they can play when negotiating, in addition to other protections that might exist.
massive, coordinated striking is a big part of leftist strategy because it skips politicians, rich people and governments entirely, it doesn’t matter who’s in power then. its a more direct way of doing democracy. this is why we say killing this mass movement in favour of bureaucracy is bad for us. at best it will slow us down and at worst it will be attacked or influenced by the next trump when the workers really need it. not that many don’t currently really need it, but the frog can always be boiled further.
well i also understand that even inside capitalism, when the state is pressured to be more democratic, the people tend to not want to fuck over other people inside and abroad to sustain the profit of a few.
we are usually treated with the same contempt by both republicans and democrats, i dont think the more open fascim republicans plan have will change anything for us until the international correlation of power changes. that and biden maintains the status quo which is already pretty bad, what is happening in gaza could very well be happening to us given the right circumstances, for example. this is why.
i don’t want trump to win because he will strain the system in the opposite direction i would want, but hes polling ahead and its looking like he will very much win regardless. strong unions are something that would 100% definetly push back but with bidens move to deflate the most important one at the time, i doubt it. this is pretty much ratchet theory or whatever its called nowadays.
https://www.ibew.org/media-center/Articles/23Daily/2306/230620_IBEWandPaid
Doesnt look like zero days to me.
You should read more.
Also, sounds like youre mad at our conservatives and piling that hate onto biden for some reason.
I know many non-US people, especially from the global south, who take the attitude: Hey the US government is full of enemies to us, don’t try to tell me anything good about any one of them, please and thanks. For them to take that viewpoint honestly makes perfect sense to me.
I know absolutely 0 of them who go on message boards and get real involved in talking with Americans about how they should view American politics and who they should support in American elections or who they shouldn’t, and how to view it, and what those people did in domestic US politics decisions and why that should impact who I support in the election.
Just one of those little mysteries one encounters sometimes
He also funded infrastructure just a little bit - there was some sort of bill concerned with it that happened
I swear, the “progressives” on lemmy are basically brain dead.
Granted, they aren’t actually progressive, but thats beside the point.
Biden has become the Obama of the terminally online. Anything bad happens? THANKS BIDEN
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No, I’m in agreement with you.