the current state of search engines (music video)
www.youtube.com
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What’s your opinion? Does google really “not work” anymore? Are there any better search engines? Why did the quality of search results go down? I honestly stumbled onto this question through this music video, what is ironic in it’s own way i feel…

  • mrmanagerA
    2·
    1 year ago

    I understand if you can’t afford it. Money doesn’t grow on trees in this world. But Kagi has been very transparent about the reason for the costs - it’s what they need to charge to not lose money, since they don’t sell your user data or track you.

    It’s unrealistic to think that having a search engine is free, and the reason Google is free is because it tracks you and sells your data to advertisers, and probably also makes sure you get search results that benefit those advertisers. It’s quite simply a bad choice to use an ad company to search the web.

    Kagi also had a blog post about search usage, where they used googles search statistics to determine that the average person searches 3 or 4 times per day (90 to 120 times per month). This amount (100 searches) is free on Kagi.

    300 searches costs 5 dollars.

    If you are doing 1000 searches per month, that’s as much as myself and I work as a programmer / devops guy. We search a lot. That’s much more than the average person. We are in the top 1% actually. Nice to be there for something right? :) Cost for us is 10 dollars.

    I couldn’t find anything about your claim that conversion would cost extra, not on the pricing page and not in the FAQ section. I also did a few conversation searches and there was no info about additional price. Can you link to where it says that?

    • asap@feddit.de
      3·
      1 year ago

      I couldn’t find anything about your claim that conversion would cost extra, not on the pricing page and not in the FAQ section. I also did a few conversation searches and there was no info about additional price. Can you link to where it says that?

      Just look at your billing page and do a few of those searches. You will see they count as a paid search - nothing special you need to look for.

      I’m not saying they charge extra for them, just that they charge for them like other searches. Doing math in the address bar is so second-nature to me now, and it seems a bit silly for Kagi to charge me for working out what 2 * 8 is.

      Kagi has been very transparent about the reason for the costs - it’s what they need to charge to not lose money, since they don’t sell your user data or track you.

      I’ve seen their posts on this, but the question is how accurate that data is. 80 searches costing Kagi $1 doesn’t intuitively feel reasonable, but perhaps it is the truth. Google’s search API is $1 per 200 queries, and you would assume they make a profit at that pricing: https://developers.google.com/custom-search/v1/overview#pricing

      Of all the subscriptions I have, this one seems like the least value for money for me personally, when I can get for example 5TB of cloud storage for less cost.

      It’s not that I’m comparing no-search to search, it’s that I’m comparing the incremental improvement from DDG to Kagi, and considering whether that improvement is worth $10 or $25 a month.

      • mrmanagerA
        3·
        1 year ago

        Ah sorry, I misunderstood you. Yes they count as a search.

        I don’t think you can compare pricing to Google. They make profits by combining any payment with selling your data for profit. There is no way Kagi can compete with that since they don’t sell your data.

        To me, search is the most important thing I use the internet for. I just think it’s reasonable to pay a good competitor that doesn’t sell your data and provides excellent search. But if you can’t pay them, of course that’s fine. Maybe you need 10 dollars for something else. But for me, Im not in the financial zone where I even miss 10 dollars or notice it’s gone.

        • asap@feddit.de
          4·
          1 year ago

          To me, search is the most important thing I use the internet for

          I like this framing. That might help me come to terms with their cost 👍

          • mrmanagerA
            2·
            1 year ago

            It’s honestly why I’m paying for it.

            I also pay for email for the same reason. :)

            For email, Fastmail is just excellent. I use their email aliases function a lot. So you can one-click generate an email to use when you sign up on a service and when you don’t use that service anymore, delete the email address.

            Makes it impossible for them to sign you up on advertising lists since you can just delete that email address if they annoy you.

            • asap@feddit.de
              2·
              1 year ago

              Me too. That’s probably the easiest comparison and one of the reasons I struggle with Kagi’s pricing. I get Proton’s highest paid plan for less cost… and that includes all their products, mail, VPN, 3TB cloud storage, and clearly doesn’t sell any of my data since they don’t have any access to it. Not to mention that my paid plan subsidises free users. (Assuming I upgrade to Kagi Unlimited which it definitely looks like I will be.)

              I use their email aliases function a lot. So you can one-click generate an email to use when you sign up on a service and when you don’t use that service anymore, delete the email address.

              I do the same thing, but with a catch-all email. Only started doing that this year and it makes such a huge difference when signing up for services!

              (I know that Proton has a similar one-click service, but I worry about some scenario 10 years in the future where they decide to shut it down and I have to migrate all my logins.)

              • mrmanagerA
                1·
                1 year ago

                That’s an apples to oranges comparison. Proton is not a web search engine.

                Edit: But for email, sure. :)

                • asap@feddit.de
                  1·
                  1 year ago

                  Sure, but the perceived value for my money. Hence why I appreciated the “search is the most important thing I use the internet for” comment.

                  • mrmanagerA
                    2·
                    1 year ago

                    Ah yes.

                    I also worry a bit about all these email aliases I use now. They do tie me to fastmail for the future. And if they would disappear, it would be a pain to replace. But that’s life. Have to take some risks. :)